Oct. 20, 2025

Canon Crossfire: Does the Protestant Bible Blow Up the Case for Christianity?

Canon Crossfire: Does the Protestant Bible Blow Up the Case for Christianity?
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Season 2

Today, we’re joined by Matthew McWhorter, a retired corporate attorney, former atheist, and author of Canon Crossfire: Does the Protestant Bible Blow Up the Case for Christianity?. After a near-death experience, Matthew launched a courtroom-style investigation into Scripture—and what he discovered will shake your assumptions. From the Apocrypha to the resurrection, his findings are bold, evidence-based, and spiritually electrifying. You can learn more at CanonCrossfire.com.

Bill Martinez Live is broadcast live Mondays at 3PM ET on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Bill Martinez is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).

Bill Martinez Live Podcast is also available on https://www.billmartinezshow.com,  Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.

Transcript
WEBVTT

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The topics and opinions express in the following show are

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solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not

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those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We

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make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,

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or products mentioned on air or on our web. No liability,

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explicit or implied shall be extended to W four CY

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Radio or it's employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments

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should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for

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choosing W FOURCY Radio.

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Well, hello, glad you could join us. Bill Martinez here

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if you're ready, and even if you're not ready, get ready.

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We're going to do a deep dive into the Bible.

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Okay.

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Our next guest, Matthew Mark mcwarter, and i'll tell you

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more about him in just a moment, has written quite

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a book called Canon Crossfire. Does the Protestant Bible blow

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up the case for Christianity? And I'll tell you, like

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I said, put on your seatbelts, because you know, as

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we see evil erupting across the globe and revival sweeping

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the streets of America, millions are turning to Christ with

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burning questions. But what if the answers they seek aren't

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found in the pages that most churches preach from. Good question, well,

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what if the key to defending the resurrection lies in

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the very books that were left behind? Well, Matthew McWaters

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I mentioned he's a retired corporate attorney, former atheist, and

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author of Cannon Crossfired. Does the Protestant Bible blow up?

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The case for Christianity is going to be joining us?

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And after a near death experience, Matthew launched a courtroom

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style investigation into scripture and what he discovered is going

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to shake your assumptions from the Apocrypha to the resurrection.

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His findings are bold, evidence based and spiritually electrifying, and

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you can learn more at his website Cannon Crossfire dot com.

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So buckle up, buttercup. This is one of these conversations

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that you won't forget and you'll be glad you joined

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us for Matthew, welcome the show.

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Good to have you with us.

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Thank you very much, glad to be here. God bless hey,

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God bless you.

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I'm so excited to talk to you because you know,

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although when we first talked, I'd mentioned that you were

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I you know, you were an atheist, but you said

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not exactly an atheist, but kind of an atheist. I

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don't know, small atheist, I guess. But you know, it's

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interesting because after your near death experience, you thought, okay,

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maybe I had to check out this Jesus stuff. And

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you went into this with a legal background and wiring

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in your legal training to make sure that you just

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weren't getting duped because up to I guess I got

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to imagine up over the years, you know, whenever any

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discussion of the Bible or Jesus Christ came up, you

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just probably your brain just shut it off and said,

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you know, I'm just not I'm not buying it. But

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you know, maybe in part you did it out of

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durance because you didn't have the whole truth nothing but

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and you hadn't studied it. But all of a sudden,

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after this near death experience, it was time for you

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to do a deep dive.

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Is that fair to say?

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Yeah? I mean literally, the only reason I read the

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book was because my name's Matthew Mark a quarter I

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was named after it.

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So I at least at least two parts of the gospel.

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Matthew Art and your.

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Mom should have added Luke and John to really get

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make me.

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I have been bitter my whole life because whenever people

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ask me where is Luke and John, I'm like, where

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is my twin? Why did I not have a twin?

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Right right exactly?

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But I read the book. I actually there were other

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books that you know. There was something by a collection

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of four Western stories from Dane Gray that my grandfather

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had given me, and they were all the same bucket list. Like,

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I didn't Hickley select religious books to read. It was

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just all the books I hadn't read yet. Yes, so

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that's what happened. I just started reading it started wondering.

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I'm told a lot of pastors say this that lawyers

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convert more frequently than other professions because we're used to

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seeing guyewitness testimony. We know what that looks like, That's

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what the Gospels are, We recognize that, and then the

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question becomes, well is this true eyewitness testimony or fake

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eyewitness testimony? And from there forward it was It was

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just an investigation. And it went on for several years

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of merely a mechanical exercise of me being curious. Before

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I started really believing and started moving into a natural

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religious sphere. I was as you say, a small a atheist.

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I didn't hate religion. I just didn't care. And part

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of that not caring was I didn't even know why

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people went to church. So I kind of converted myself.

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You know. There was no church converting me. There was

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no person converting me. It was just a pile of books.

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And along the way in the conversion, I had to realize,

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oh wait a minute, I have to go to church.

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But that came later, Like I didn't. I originally sort

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of thought of Christianity without a church. You know why

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bother I got other things to do on Sunday.

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So anyway, that was a big part though, foundationally about

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our faith is that it is a personal relationship exactly.

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That's where it starts, and that's why it's so important

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that you honor that relationship, those those initial depths that

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you take into your faith. So when you decide to

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plant your feet in a body of Christ a church,

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that you're careful about where you plant your seed.

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Right, yeah, absolutely, and that that is the spiritual risk,

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religious Christian way of looking at it. To be honest,

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as an outsider, I was, I ain't joining your cult

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until you know, like you got to prove it to

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me first. So that's why it was such a written thing.

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So either way, whichever side of the coin you're looking at,

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it's a crucial part of the decision as to you know,

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what what religion is. That it's that personal relationship, also

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that it's corporate, that it's it's collective and communal and social,

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you know, that comes through the Bible. That and it

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all leads to the same place. But there's there's many

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ways of looking at it, in ways of pointing you

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to the same same destination in the end, which is

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to go to the right church exactly.

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And I got to imagine for you, first of all,

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being an attorney. But the other thing is that you

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put years, lots of years in time into really making

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you know, coming to make this commitment. Many people, it's

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it's almost like we used to say in California, because

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I grew up close to the beach, it.

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Was like surfs up.

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You know, It's just it's a surfs up emotional kind

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of thing, and and so and and in some ways

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that can tend to be a little bit surfacing, they're

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really the depth of somebody's relationship with God. As a

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former pastor, friend of mine used to say is about

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as deep as a dime. And that's unfortunate because in

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those situations, especially if you happen to run into them

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in church and you think, hey, this is a fellow believer,

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and you know, all of a sudden you go, well maybe.

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Not yeah, absolutely, and I I but trying. You know,

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this whole experience of me writing the book and talking

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to people about it and having readers, et cetera. I

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am such a strange person. I'm not like other people

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in many ways, and one of them is exactly that

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kind of journey of it. Never once occurred to me

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to just have a you know, flash and all of

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a sudden it was there. But to me it was

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a long intellectual exercise and that is not normal, but

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part of it because I am that kind of person.

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The way I came to it. I think that's why

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I did all this work, and why now that I've

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done the work, it's so easy for anyone else to

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see the points that I'm making and learn about what

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I'm doing. But somebody had to be so interested in

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this question that they would go to the depths that

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I went, and I guess that was me.

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Well, you know, you've done a lot of the hard work.

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You know, for some of us that would not would

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not do that. You know, our relationship and our wiring

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and the way God designed us, just like he designed you.

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He knew that you were going to go and do

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the deep dive that I mean, he he designed you

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that way.

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And so that when he held off. I think part

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of the reason why I wasn't Christian my whole life

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is God saying I needed He wanted somebody, and he

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picked me to wait until they had a lifetime of

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skill and a reason to do all this research and

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to look at two questions at the same time without

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really caring what the answers were to either of them.

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One is Christianity true? And the other one is which

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Bible am I supposed to be reading? And it was

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looking at that at the exact same moment that let

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me see this cannon crossfire that my book's about. And

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I don't know how many people would have seen this

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or have seen it over time, and it's just such

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a crucial part of how I looked at things, and

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as I said, led me to do all of this work.

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I feel like God had a reason for everything that

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he did.

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Well, just like he had a reason to bring two

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knuckleheads together like.

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You and me.

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I have this conversation with all due respect, I mean,

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because I'll tell you I mean. I have considered myself

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a theologian. I graduated from Bible College. I study the.

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Word of God.

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I'm in it on a regular basis. I took Jesus

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for his word, and when he said that man does

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not live by bread alone, but by every word that

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comes from the mouth of God, I figure if Jesus

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said that, I'm going.

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To take note here, So.

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You know, I took him at his word, and I

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look back experientially in the journey that I've been on

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that God, in his grace and mercy, has allowed me

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to take.

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I'm grateful for it.

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I did not ask that question, and I appreciate and

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respect that you did, because it really takes us down,

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you know, an important and critical road that I think

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it's gonna bless people who are tuning in and who

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will watch this segment, because it'll cause them to ask

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other questions, like you know what. I had that question

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in the back of my mind. I didn't ask it,

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but I'm gonna ask it. And Matthew has encouraged me

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to do that. But look before we get into that,

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for just a moment. A couple times now we've talked

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and I've mentioned your near death experience.

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Do you mind telling us that story?

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Yeah, I was a successful attorney, prime on my life

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forty three I think when it all started. And then

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one day my father got cancer. So I was told

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to go get my own test. And I assumed I

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would find out twenty years from now that I have cancer,

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but that right now would just be a warning about

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it for now that I had cancer far worse than

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my dad.

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Oh wow.

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And so they played an operation to deal with the cancer.

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Days later. This all happen. Within a month, I had

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what's called a widow maker heart attack. It's the most

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dangerous heart attack. About ninety nine percent of people die

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die right there on the floor from it immediately.

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Yeah, they measure They measure that in seconds, I think, exactly.

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And it's just a rush to see how fast you

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can get to the hospital. Among other things. That I

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got lucky or God was looking out for me, however

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you want to look at it was. This all happened

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in Houston, Texas. And I can assure you if it

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had happened in the afternoon, i'd be dead because there's

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no way you're getting a hospital at a time. But

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luckily traffic alone will kill you in Houstone exactly. And

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this happened in the middle of the night. I managed

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to get to the hospital in time. They performed the operation,

230
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saved my life. But then the cancer treatment's delayed, you know,

231
00:11:40.440 --> 00:11:44.399
all the stuff. So it's you know, shocking numbers of

232
00:11:44.919 --> 00:11:47.679
shocking percentage chance that I had to stay alive, and

233
00:11:47.759 --> 00:11:51.320
yet somehow I did. And that's amazing.

234
00:11:51.320 --> 00:11:55.399
I mean, here you are, You're dealing with a cancer diagnosis,

235
00:11:54.480 --> 00:11:57.799
and as if that's not enough, hey, let's throw in

236
00:11:57.840 --> 00:12:00.120
a little widow maker heart problem right.

237
00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:02.840
Exactly, And all for a guy who had just passed

238
00:12:02.840 --> 00:12:06.240
a physical like right beforehand. I mean, like it's crazy,

239
00:12:06.279 --> 00:12:08.919
but you know, as I learned, those physicals are not

240
00:12:09.080 --> 00:12:12.039
the most perfect diagnosis of whether you really are healthy.

241
00:12:12.080 --> 00:12:16.120
But it just came as a shock. And so as

242
00:12:16.200 --> 00:12:18.639
I was recovering from all of this, the question was, well,

243
00:12:19.159 --> 00:12:21.399
I might not have a long time to live. I

244
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really wasn't spiritual at this point. As I was saying

245
00:12:23.720 --> 00:12:25.480
it was just like, literally, what do I want to

246
00:12:25.519 --> 00:12:28.240
do before I die, And some of that answer was

247
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read some books, and that's how I started down this journey.

248
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So it was still years ahead before I really became

249
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spiritual about looking back at all that. At the time,

250
00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:39.240
I would have just said I got lucky, et cetera.

251
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But like now I can sort of you can see

252
00:12:40.879 --> 00:12:43.759
God working all long, right, But at the time, I

253
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wouldn't have said that. And it, like I said, it

254
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just came as a shock. It happens to other people.

255
00:12:49.440 --> 00:12:52.200
Just happened to me when I was young, and you know,

256
00:12:52.600 --> 00:12:56.399
it was definitely life altering, but I had already had

257
00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:00.600
plans to retire young. So I then years later, I retire,

258
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I focus on these books and I did all this research.

259
00:13:03.039 --> 00:13:05.360
So that's that's really where it all comes from, is

260
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just having that free time and having the inclination to,

261
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because of this event, to do the do the looking

262
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into the research.

263
00:13:13.559 --> 00:13:16.159
So you mentioned Pos's pox.

264
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He's fine. His cancer they can't operate on so it's

265
00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:22.960
just a matter of you know, dealing with it. So

266
00:13:23.240 --> 00:13:27.600
but he is fine, doing great. Seventy five. In my family,

267
00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:29.879
it is shocking that anyone made it to the age

268
00:13:29.919 --> 00:13:33.240
of sixty. So the fact that my dad my mom

269
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are both alive. Is kind of amazing. My grandparents all

270
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died there, so you know, and both my mom and

271
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my dad had major heart problems and other problems along

272
00:13:41.799 --> 00:13:44.799
the way too. So but do it fine, So we're good.

273
00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:47.440
Well, just like you, you know, it ain't over until

274
00:13:47.440 --> 00:13:48.879
it's over until God says.

275
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So right, he's hard to kill.

276
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He says, when we're coming and when we're leaving.

277
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I mean, there's just no absolutely right, it's just and

278
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even how we have, even how we exit. Yeah, I

279
00:14:00.600 --> 00:14:03.679
mean he's got it down, you know, as the word says,

280
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he knows the end from the beginning, so we can

281
00:14:07.279 --> 00:14:11.360
rest in that. Well that's quite the story. So here

282
00:14:11.919 --> 00:14:14.759
you go through this and then you ask these two questions.

283
00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:18.879
All right, I've got a Protestant Bible and i got.

284
00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:21.240
A Catholic Bible, and that's exactly what happened. So I'm

285
00:14:21.320 --> 00:14:23.360
just I just want to read the books I'm named after.

286
00:14:23.679 --> 00:14:26.720
So I went on Amazon and say, said, okay, what

287
00:14:27.000 --> 00:14:29.080
by a Bible? And it's like, well, there's you know,

288
00:14:29.399 --> 00:14:33.159
radically different translations. They all come with different commentaries from

289
00:14:33.200 --> 00:14:35.639
all these different denominations. And then you find out the

290
00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:38.960
Orthodox Protestants and Catholics have three completely different Bibles. So

291
00:14:39.159 --> 00:14:41.559
about a box of bibles, not just a Bible.

292
00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:44.639
And so and so your study takes you through all

293
00:14:44.679 --> 00:14:48.200
these Bibles. When you say that they're all radically different,

294
00:14:48.519 --> 00:14:50.519
isn't there I mean there's some core books, I mean

295
00:14:51.279 --> 00:14:53.279
absolutely and beliefs.

296
00:14:53.399 --> 00:14:55.840
Yes, there's You know, if you're a Protestant, if you

297
00:14:55.879 --> 00:14:58.399
read a Catholic Bible, you would love ninety percent of it,

298
00:14:58.559 --> 00:15:02.480
and vice versa. Nine percent of it wouldn't bother you,

299
00:15:03.000 --> 00:15:04.840
even though it's a little different from what you're used

300
00:15:04.879 --> 00:15:07.399
to or what you truly believe whatever. And then one

301
00:15:07.440 --> 00:15:09.799
percent would be what you'd argue over. And of course

302
00:15:09.879 --> 00:15:11.080
all we do is argue.

303
00:15:11.960 --> 00:15:14.639
Well that's hey, it's it's all part you know, it's

304
00:15:14.720 --> 00:15:18.639
my Jewish friend says, you know, all Jews argue, and

305
00:15:18.720 --> 00:15:22.960
so we're all, you know, we're all from that heritage.

306
00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:24.799
So yeah, okay, welcome to the club.

307
00:15:25.080 --> 00:15:27.679
Yeah we joined them, yes exactly.

308
00:15:28.039 --> 00:15:31.120
So, as I mentioned, we got sixty six books in

309
00:15:31.159 --> 00:15:35.799
the Protestant Bible and seventy three books in the in

310
00:15:35.840 --> 00:15:40.600
the Catholic Bible. So talk about you know the difference

311
00:15:40.679 --> 00:15:44.279
and also the terminology because some people will hear the

312
00:15:44.399 --> 00:15:49.320
apocrypha and may not understand what that what that means,

313
00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:53.320
or the Jutero canonical books.

314
00:15:53.559 --> 00:15:56.840
Yeah, so judoro chnonical is usually the more polite term.

315
00:15:57.000 --> 00:16:00.399
The apocrypha is kind of an insult. In goal terms,

316
00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:03.960
we would call it a conclusory statement. Uh, if something

317
00:16:04.039 --> 00:16:06.720
is apocrypha, it's not scripture. So by using that term,

318
00:16:06.759 --> 00:16:07.919
you're already you know.

319
00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:09.159
You're already indicting.

320
00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:12.759
Yeah, you've already made your decision. You're you're highlighting it.

321
00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:15.399
So probably the better term is due to orcononical. But

322
00:16:15.559 --> 00:16:18.960
most Protestants use apocrypha. So my book, which is really yeah.

323
00:16:18.799 --> 00:16:21.519
Because you can't say dodo cron you realize that's such

324
00:16:21.559 --> 00:16:24.519
a tongue twister. I mean, I run across that I

325
00:16:24.519 --> 00:16:26.879
can't say, and I keep thinking, okay, God, please let

326
00:16:26.919 --> 00:16:29.039
me just let it, let it flow from my tongue.

327
00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:31.200
But I have to really think and through.

328
00:16:31.679 --> 00:16:36.360
Get get I get the doutero right, and then canonical Okay,

329
00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:38.039
all right, I have to I have to think about

330
00:16:38.039 --> 00:16:39.039
it exactly.

331
00:16:39.159 --> 00:16:42.240
And it's not an easily defined term even if you're

332
00:16:42.320 --> 00:16:44.080
using the term, so you got to be careful with

333
00:16:44.120 --> 00:16:47.159
it to my mind is merely the books that Catholics

334
00:16:47.159 --> 00:16:50.159
accept and Protestants do not. That is the Doudo organic.

335
00:16:50.240 --> 00:16:51.879
But as I say in my own book, I actually

336
00:16:51.960 --> 00:16:54.840
use the word apocrypha because I'm really talking to Protestants,

337
00:16:54.840 --> 00:16:57.039
so I use their language when I'm talking to But

338
00:16:57.879 --> 00:17:00.759
as terminology goes, it's it's not a good word and

339
00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:03.039
shouldn't be used for these books. Really, when you're talking

340
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in this where you're arguing or discussing whether or not

341
00:17:06.400 --> 00:17:09.839
they are authentic, you should not be using the apocryphy, right.

342
00:17:10.440 --> 00:17:14.200
And the apocrypha consists of seven books, yeah, as you

343
00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:18.960
write about in Canon Crossfire Bus, additions to Esther and Daniel,

344
00:17:19.519 --> 00:17:23.720
and so I hope you're taking notes here exactly.

345
00:17:23.799 --> 00:17:26.920
And the thing the thing about it, as it's discussed

346
00:17:26.920 --> 00:17:29.400
in my book, these are kind of objects, right, So

347
00:17:29.640 --> 00:17:31.559
if you think about it as a trial, they're the

348
00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:34.839
in dispute in the trial. But you don't actually have

349
00:17:34.880 --> 00:17:36.799
to know all that much about the books. You don't

350
00:17:36.799 --> 00:17:38.319
have to have read the books. We're just going to

351
00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:42.319
talk about them. And you know, as you say, there

352
00:17:42.480 --> 00:17:45.079
there are full books, there are pieces of books, There

353
00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:48.119
are things that could be full books set off as

354
00:17:48.119 --> 00:17:51.559
a full book or included as part of others. Because

355
00:17:51.640 --> 00:17:56.799
Daniel is an anthology, it is a collection of stories already,

356
00:17:56.880 --> 00:17:58.839
so then it's a question of what story should be

357
00:17:58.839 --> 00:18:02.440
part of the anthology. And so Susannah, for example, could

358
00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:04.279
stand off on its own. It does so in the

359
00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:07.759
sixteen to eleven King James version, or it could be

360
00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:10.119
part of Daniel as it is in Catholic books. It's

361
00:18:10.119 --> 00:18:11.640
at the back of Daniel, or it could be at

362
00:18:11.640 --> 00:18:14.319
the front of Daniel as it is in Orthodox books.

363
00:18:14.359 --> 00:18:17.720
Because even order within Daniel, you know, is a choice.

364
00:18:17.880 --> 00:18:18.880
It's all editorial.

365
00:18:19.240 --> 00:18:22.200
Well, and what people need to remember is the Bible

366
00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:25.960
originally they didn't have they didn't have chapters, I mean,

367
00:18:26.000 --> 00:18:27.599
you know, and didn't have numbers.

368
00:18:27.640 --> 00:18:30.359
I mean, it was all versus no chapters, and it

369
00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:34.400
the technology of the book had not yet been invented,

370
00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:37.279
so that what we call a codex. But you know,

371
00:18:37.319 --> 00:18:40.079
the physical concept of putting all these things inside a

372
00:18:40.079 --> 00:18:42.640
binder and you know, tying them up on the left

373
00:18:42.640 --> 00:18:45.319
hand side, et cetera, that didn't exist. It's all scrolls

374
00:18:45.400 --> 00:18:48.240
early on right, and that's part of the you know

375
00:18:48.400 --> 00:18:50.640
issues kind of I don't really deal with it in

376
00:18:50.640 --> 00:18:53.039
my book. But it's it's a question about this all,

377
00:18:53.599 --> 00:18:56.880
this whole concept of a canon, a list of books

378
00:18:56.880 --> 00:18:58.759
that the correct books to be in the Bible, that

379
00:18:58.920 --> 00:19:02.319
really kind of emergent just later because of the technology

380
00:19:02.359 --> 00:19:05.359
of the book. Until then, the Bible was a pile

381
00:19:05.400 --> 00:19:06.640
of scrolls, right.

382
00:19:06.920 --> 00:19:11.440
But but initially though the apocrypha you know, uh, I

383
00:19:11.440 --> 00:19:13.559
guess we could say was was all part of it.

384
00:19:13.599 --> 00:19:14.559
I mean goes back and.

385
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:18.160
It's all the way Jewish books. So the first thing,

386
00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:20.680
because I'm always amazed when I talk to the Protestants

387
00:19:20.680 --> 00:19:22.640
on the street about this whatever, you will run into

388
00:19:22.799 --> 00:19:25.000
a large number of them that say, well, Catholics invented

389
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:27.359
those books and added them. No, no, no, no, they

390
00:19:27.359 --> 00:19:30.519
are Jewish books exactly. They pre exist christ They were

391
00:19:30.519 --> 00:19:33.880
out there. The question is who was accepting these books,

392
00:19:33.880 --> 00:19:37.000
Were they really accepted as scripture, et cetera. That is

393
00:19:37.039 --> 00:19:39.119
not at all the same question as you know, when

394
00:19:39.119 --> 00:19:42.960
they were made, and you know they they pre exist

395
00:19:43.279 --> 00:19:47.039
price and and have known dates in certain cases, known

396
00:19:47.079 --> 00:19:51.640
translation dates even in other cases. So it's it's you know,

397
00:19:52.279 --> 00:19:55.319
it's a question about Judaism. Really at the heart of

398
00:19:55.359 --> 00:19:58.039
it is what what was the Jewish scripture? What is

399
00:19:58.079 --> 00:20:00.319
it that we're supposed to be using and not using

400
00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:03.079
as Christian to derive come from Judea?

401
00:20:03.359 --> 00:20:06.400
Yeah, but interesting though, and what comes out right away

402
00:20:06.880 --> 00:20:10.240
for me, Matthew, As Jesus said, not a dot or

403
00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:14.480
tittle would be removed, you know that everything would be fulfilled. Well,

404
00:20:14.480 --> 00:20:16.279
if that's the case and you're not dealing with the

405
00:20:16.359 --> 00:20:21.519
whole scripture and all the books of the Bible, then

406
00:20:21.880 --> 00:20:24.839
you're kind of in conflict with what Jesus said.

407
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.960
Yeah, and I so my book The Canon cross Righter

408
00:20:28.000 --> 00:20:30.400
the subtitles does the Protestant Bible blow up the case

409
00:20:30.400 --> 00:20:32.400
for Christianity? And every once in a while run into

410
00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:35.920
Catholics who say, well, protests are never going to read this,

411
00:20:36.359 --> 00:20:39.079
and you know, because it's anti Protestant, et cetera. It's

412
00:20:39.119 --> 00:20:41.240
actually not anti Protestant at all. First of all, but

413
00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:44.200
the second is, if you read any Protestant book on

414
00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:47.200
the Bible, particularly on the Canon, it starts with a

415
00:20:47.240 --> 00:20:50.640
long explanation of we better be right on the Canon,

416
00:20:50.680 --> 00:20:53.079
because if we're wrong on that, we're wrong on everything. Right.

417
00:20:53.160 --> 00:20:55.599
It is the single most important issue of all of

418
00:20:55.720 --> 00:20:59.400
Protestant thinking in theology and philosophy and logic, all of it.

419
00:20:59.400 --> 00:21:02.200
It's all off the Bible and being correct at the

420
00:21:02.279 --> 00:21:05.480
very beginning. So that's part of my book is explaining

421
00:21:05.480 --> 00:21:09.319
how important this is and too, even to considering the

422
00:21:09.359 --> 00:21:12.319
rest of Protestant thinking, you have to start with this.

423
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:15.480
So when you you quote the Jesus about the every

424
00:21:15.559 --> 00:21:18.400
jot and tittle, the Protestants would agree with you. And

425
00:21:18.880 --> 00:21:21.240
in point of fact, one of the reasons that I

426
00:21:21.400 --> 00:21:23.799
this is the book that I wrote is that Protestants

427
00:21:23.839 --> 00:21:26.680
love this topic. They love scripture. They want to talk

428
00:21:26.720 --> 00:21:30.880
about scripture, and discussing what really is authentic scripture is

429
00:21:30.960 --> 00:21:33.680
right up their alley. So this is a fascinating thing

430
00:21:33.720 --> 00:21:36.119
for them as well. They would agree with what Jesus said,

431
00:21:36.160 --> 00:21:38.680
they don't necessarily agree on the result. But that's the

432
00:21:38.759 --> 00:21:41.680
question that we're here to talk about, right is what

433
00:21:41.480 --> 00:21:43.359
are what were the johns and tittles? Right?

434
00:21:43.559 --> 00:21:44.440
Right? Exactly?

435
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:48.920
Well, and when you consider the apocryphy, as you said, rightly,

436
00:21:48.960 --> 00:21:53.039
so these are Jewish books, okay, And the in the

437
00:21:53.079 --> 00:21:57.319
arena of evidence you always look, especially when things are

438
00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:03.160
closer to the occurrence, right, uh, eyewitness reports, whatever, it is,

439
00:22:03.519 --> 00:22:08.400
the closer to that point of contact that validates or

440
00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:13.759
heightens the value of said testimony right or evidence.

441
00:22:13.440 --> 00:22:16.759
Absolutely, and Protestants will stress that point in the case

442
00:22:16.759 --> 00:22:20.880
for Christ, where the earliest evidence is generally considered the

443
00:22:20.880 --> 00:22:24.559
best evidence, but they also almost all of their theology

444
00:22:24.599 --> 00:22:27.759
and their their argumentation with Catholics, et cetera, is a

445
00:22:27.799 --> 00:22:30.720
claim that they feel that they have the original Church,

446
00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:33.480
the original Bible, the original preaching of Jesus and the

447
00:22:33.519 --> 00:22:37.160
apostles before the Catholic Church ruined him right or before

448
00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:40.359
for the Church, you know, would get ruined. That's the

449
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:45.519
general mindset of what they're saying, right, And their question

450
00:22:46.119 --> 00:22:49.640
that I'm addressing, you know, back in the face, is

451
00:22:49.640 --> 00:22:51.039
is that accurate about the cannon?

452
00:22:51.400 --> 00:22:51.680
Right?

453
00:22:51.799 --> 00:22:55.759
And that's that's where this disconnect, this crossfire starts occurring.

454
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:59.680
Is suddenly Protestants start saying that the evidence for the

455
00:22:59.720 --> 00:23:04.039
canon is it comes too late. And okay, you want

456
00:23:04.039 --> 00:23:05.640
to say it came too late. Well, let's look at

457
00:23:05.680 --> 00:23:07.759
the evidence that you claim in the case for Christ

458
00:23:07.799 --> 00:23:11.359
that was early improves the gospels. Okay, you claim that

459
00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:14.519
it's early here, it's late here, they're the same evidence.

460
00:23:14.599 --> 00:23:17.079
Did you notice that That is the point of my

461
00:23:17.160 --> 00:23:21.039
crossfire discussion, is that Protestants are making two different arguments

462
00:23:21.400 --> 00:23:23.559
and not realizing they're talking about the exact same piece

463
00:23:23.559 --> 00:23:27.759
of evidence. So this whole mental framework that the earliest

464
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:30.519
is the best is called into question when we're talking

465
00:23:30.519 --> 00:23:31.160
about the cannon.

466
00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:35.359
You see, this is the thing I've always said, Matthew,

467
00:23:35.400 --> 00:23:38.319
early on in my relationship with God, is I didn't

468
00:23:38.359 --> 00:23:41.480
believe that Jesus went to the cross for denominations. And

469
00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:45.160
you know, just like even in the political process of

470
00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:47.720
where our country is right now, which is driving me crazy,

471
00:23:48.119 --> 00:23:49.799
is I think we've got to get rid of parties.

472
00:23:50.039 --> 00:23:52.160
Parties divide us, just like.

473
00:23:52.559 --> 00:23:55.079
George Washington said it from the Yeah.

474
00:23:54.680 --> 00:23:56.880
Actually, be careful, be careful.

475
00:23:57.200 --> 00:23:59.799
And here we are, and you know, we got all

476
00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:02.680
this struggle going on, and they're trying to find an

477
00:24:02.720 --> 00:24:06.240
answer here on earth when the answer is in heaven.

478
00:24:06.519 --> 00:24:11.119
Yeah. No, it's I should say, Protestants have loved my book.

479
00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:13.440
Every Protestant who's ever read it has had nothing but

480
00:24:13.559 --> 00:24:18.079
five star reviews, et cetera. It is a topic that

481
00:24:18.119 --> 00:24:20.720
they enjoy. They understand the approach that I'm taking, which

482
00:24:20.759 --> 00:24:23.680
is purely evidence based, and it's not an attack on

483
00:24:23.720 --> 00:24:27.799
their beliefs as you say about denominations, etc. There are

484
00:24:27.880 --> 00:24:30.599
many ways to resolve this conflict that I'm pointing out.

485
00:24:30.680 --> 00:24:33.640
You could be Catholic, you could be Orthodox, you could

486
00:24:33.640 --> 00:24:36.400
be a kind of Protestant who accepts a Catholic Bible.

487
00:24:36.759 --> 00:24:38.839
That's all I'm addressing is what is the right Bible?

488
00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:40.799
What are the right books? You know, at a very

489
00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:44.759
preliminary stage, it hasn't offended anybody yet, everybody's liked it.

490
00:24:45.839 --> 00:24:49.400
And it's not really a pro Catholic point that I'm making,

491
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:52.839
nor an anti Protestant point that I'm making. What I'm

492
00:24:52.839 --> 00:24:56.599
saying is these Catholic books that the books of Catholics

493
00:24:56.640 --> 00:24:59.880
accept I think should be in everybody's Bible. But regardless,

494
00:25:00.039 --> 00:25:02.359
all I'm doing is showing you the evidence and leaving

495
00:25:02.400 --> 00:25:04.759
it for you to decide. The key thing is that

496
00:25:04.759 --> 00:25:07.519
I'm showing that I've collected all this evidence. I've done

497
00:25:07.559 --> 00:25:10.079
the work. Now everyone can use it as a basis

498
00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:11.720
of discussion go forward. Well.

499
00:25:11.720 --> 00:25:15.240
As you concluded in your book, kenon Crossbier, is that

500
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:18.799
if we're not getting the whole story, are we missing

501
00:25:18.880 --> 00:25:22.000
out on some blessings here that God has for us?

502
00:25:22.160 --> 00:25:25.920
Right? Absolutely? And you know, if you look at the

503
00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:28.200
very earliest Christians and what they have to say about

504
00:25:28.240 --> 00:25:31.039
these books. Some of the very basic things they're telling

505
00:25:31.079 --> 00:25:35.359
you is a that they are facing martyrdom of the

506
00:25:35.480 --> 00:25:40.319
very earliest Christian fathers, as they're called, that wrote extensively.

507
00:25:40.759 --> 00:25:43.440
The names that come up all the time, seven out

508
00:25:43.440 --> 00:25:46.599
of ten of them were martyred. They were tortured and

509
00:25:46.680 --> 00:25:49.839
killed for their beliefs. As that was happening, they are

510
00:25:49.839 --> 00:25:52.559
preaching to other Christians who are about to be martyred.

511
00:25:52.880 --> 00:25:55.880
They preach a book called too mccaby as they are dying,

512
00:25:56.359 --> 00:26:00.400
many of them their last words allude to Macaby was

513
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:03.880
part of that early martyrd church, and it is. It

514
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:08.480
includes a story of martyrdom that was very spiritually fulfilling,

515
00:26:09.359 --> 00:26:12.559
involving a woman with seven sons and all seven sons

516
00:26:12.559 --> 00:26:16.000
are martyred. This was a key part of these Christians beliefs.

517
00:26:16.400 --> 00:26:18.640
Whether that makes it part of your Bible, that's a

518
00:26:18.640 --> 00:26:22.839
different question. But understand that the very earliest Christians went

519
00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:27.119
to their deaths talking to maccabees believing it was divinely inspired,

520
00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:32.400
et cetera. You know that that's powerful stuff, and you

521
00:26:32.440 --> 00:26:34.720
know it has relevance to what we're facing today.

522
00:26:35.079 --> 00:26:38.839
Did Jesus refer to the uh to these books that

523
00:26:38.839 --> 00:26:39.720
we're talking about.

524
00:26:40.119 --> 00:26:45.000
Absolutely, I quote such things as the Evangelical Theological Biblical

525
00:26:45.039 --> 00:26:48.599
Theological Commentary, where the evangelical scholars are telling you these

526
00:26:48.599 --> 00:26:51.759
are references. There are clear references to two Maccabees in

527
00:26:51.799 --> 00:26:54.480
the Epistle to the Hebrews and in the Gospel of Matthew.

528
00:26:55.799 --> 00:26:58.000
And in the Gospel of Matthew it is the words

529
00:26:58.000 --> 00:27:02.880
of Jesus alluding to the woman with seven sons. It's

530
00:27:02.960 --> 00:27:06.519
not really all that arguable in a as long as

531
00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:08.640
you don't argue it in a vacuum. If you argue

532
00:27:08.640 --> 00:27:10.279
it in a vacuum, people can just say I don't

533
00:27:10.319 --> 00:27:11.680
see it. I don't see it. I don't see it.

534
00:27:11.960 --> 00:27:13.920
But if you put this in the case for Christ,

535
00:27:14.079 --> 00:27:16.839
where you are saying, well, did you know, the question

536
00:27:16.920 --> 00:27:20.119
that skeptics will raise is did Jesus claim to be God?

537
00:27:20.519 --> 00:27:22.799
And you will see people say, well, yeah, he used

538
00:27:22.799 --> 00:27:25.400
the phrase I am, which is an illusion. Back to

539
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:29.119
the God of the Old Testament, like exactly, it's an illusion.

540
00:27:29.519 --> 00:27:33.559
You use illusions as evidence, you recognize illusions. In fact,

541
00:27:33.559 --> 00:27:36.839
prophecies are nothing but illusions. They don't there's no prophecy

542
00:27:36.880 --> 00:27:39.559
in the Old Testament that says Jesus Christ by name.

543
00:27:39.839 --> 00:27:42.640
It's an allusion to something. You say, it's fulfilled. You

544
00:27:42.759 --> 00:27:46.440
can't ignore illusions as evidence. They exist, they are real,

545
00:27:46.839 --> 00:27:49.039
They can be a debated a little bit, etc. But

546
00:27:49.319 --> 00:27:53.599
if you apply a fair, honest standard, it's inarguable that

547
00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:56.200
two maccabees is referenced in Hebrews for example.

548
00:27:56.240 --> 00:27:59.400
Right, Well, as you say, you start connecting the dots,

549
00:27:59.799 --> 00:28:03.559
and you look at what some would identify as prophecy,

550
00:28:04.279 --> 00:28:08.799
and you look at Jesus's life, and you go, how

551
00:28:08.920 --> 00:28:13.240
many of these illusions, as you put it, did the

552
00:28:13.240 --> 00:28:14.759
birth of Jesus fulfilled?

553
00:28:15.079 --> 00:28:17.440
And that's some of where my book, you know, the

554
00:28:18.400 --> 00:28:21.960
research that would become my book derives from. Is if

555
00:28:21.960 --> 00:28:24.799
you look at Josh mcdow's evidence that demands a verdict.

556
00:28:24.880 --> 00:28:27.640
So this is a famous book, seven hundred pages of

557
00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:30.759
evidence showing you that trying to prove that Christ rose

558
00:28:30.759 --> 00:28:33.519
from the dead. Very good book, part of my conversion.

559
00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:38.960
But onlike page thirty of my copy, he says, you know,

560
00:28:39.000 --> 00:28:41.359
he's answering the question of well, what about these extra books,

561
00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:43.359
and he says, well, those books are never quoted in

562
00:28:43.400 --> 00:28:46.839
the New Testament. But the books that the Protestant accepts

563
00:28:46.880 --> 00:28:50.119
are quoted and referenced hundreds of times. You notice what

564
00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:52.799
he just did. He went from only quotes for those

565
00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:56.519
books to quotes and references for his books. Those references

566
00:28:56.920 --> 00:29:00.880
are ninety to ninety nine percent of all of the

567
00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:03.640
alleged quotes of the Old Testament are not quotes at all.

568
00:29:03.759 --> 00:29:07.200
They are references, They are illusions. People don't realize how

569
00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:10.680
rare quotation was in ancient times. Again, because you were

570
00:29:10.720 --> 00:29:13.240
dealing with scrolls and people writing from memory, et cetera.

571
00:29:13.640 --> 00:29:15.920
They're mostly doing it out of their head. They're mostly

572
00:29:16.000 --> 00:29:20.599
paraphrasing and alluding to things. And you have to be

573
00:29:20.680 --> 00:29:23.400
fair about that one way or the other. Either you

574
00:29:23.480 --> 00:29:26.000
have very few quotes of the Old Testament, of even

575
00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:29.200
the Protestant Old Testament, or you have lots of references

576
00:29:29.319 --> 00:29:31.680
for both, and you have to analyze that. But that's

577
00:29:31.720 --> 00:29:34.079
a crucial piece of it. And so if you look

578
00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:37.240
at I just saw it yesterday, you know there are

579
00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:40.319
clients that there are five hundred prophecies of Jesus investment,

580
00:29:41.079 --> 00:29:44.359
and that specific when I was okay yesterday claimed three hundred.

581
00:29:45.160 --> 00:29:47.039
You can go through all of those and as I say,

582
00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:49.200
you're not going to find Jesus Christ mentioned by name.

583
00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:53.519
Those prophecies are illusions. They're very clear, all of us

584
00:29:53.599 --> 00:29:57.079
Christians except them, right, But they're only illusions, and you

585
00:29:57.200 --> 00:29:59.680
just have to be fair about that analysis and understanding.

586
00:30:00.039 --> 00:30:03.759
They are persuasive evidence to you know, any person of

587
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:08.119
goodwill when you're talking about Jesus Christ being prophesies. So

588
00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:10.240
then hold that the exact same standard when we talk

589
00:30:10.279 --> 00:30:11.400
about these other books. Right.

590
00:30:11.799 --> 00:30:14.559
But Matthew, see, and that's the key in all this

591
00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:19.359
is that are we debating and arguing to win a

592
00:30:19.480 --> 00:30:23.640
debate or an argument, or are we in pursuit of

593
00:30:23.680 --> 00:30:27.000
the truth. Absolutely and the higher calling that God has

594
00:30:27.039 --> 00:30:30.519
for all of us absolutely ignorant, you know.

595
00:30:30.799 --> 00:30:32.839
And I show this over and over throughout the book.

596
00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:36.440
It's two charts side by side showing you what Protestants

597
00:30:36.440 --> 00:30:39.400
are saying about the canon versus what they said about

598
00:30:39.799 --> 00:30:42.720
the case for Christ. It's over and overlying. You know,

599
00:30:42.759 --> 00:30:44.759
they said this on page three, they say this on

600
00:30:44.799 --> 00:30:49.319
page five. It's just showing you the mental disconnect that

601
00:30:49.359 --> 00:30:52.839
happens to absolutely everybody, and it's happened to Protestants in

602
00:30:52.880 --> 00:30:55.279
this context. They see the mote in the other guy's

603
00:30:55.279 --> 00:30:58.240
eye while ignoring the log in their own, as the

604
00:30:58.240 --> 00:31:01.160
Bible tells us, and they don't recognize that they're having

605
00:31:01.200 --> 00:31:04.559
these two separate conversations. They're telling skeptics, come to us,

606
00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:07.480
come to Jesus because we have all this evidence, but

607
00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:10.039
that Catholic evidence. Don't believe a word of it. And

608
00:31:10.079 --> 00:31:13.400
it guys, it's the same thing, right, And that's the

609
00:31:13.400 --> 00:31:15.759
point of my book is just to make that crystal

610
00:31:15.799 --> 00:31:18.480
clear for people and then we can discuss it from there.

611
00:31:18.519 --> 00:31:20.240
I don't resolve the question as to what to do.

612
00:31:20.480 --> 00:31:22.640
It's just that is the conflict that we all have

613
00:31:22.720 --> 00:31:25.559
to recognize and start thinking in our heads. Okay, now what.

614
00:31:25.759 --> 00:31:27.640
Well, you know, it's interesting because it seems to me

615
00:31:28.279 --> 00:31:32.279
that it is somewhat of an extension of when Jesus

616
00:31:32.400 --> 00:31:34.359
was on earth and the conflict that he had with

617
00:31:34.440 --> 00:31:38.839
the religious you know, fathers and leaders at the time.

618
00:31:39.000 --> 00:31:41.599
Right, it's absolutely and it's all the same thing. When

619
00:31:41.599 --> 00:31:44.160
you're talking, when you're trying to preach the case for Christ,

620
00:31:44.680 --> 00:31:48.960
case for Christianity to a skeptic, you're dealing with that unfairness,

621
00:31:49.200 --> 00:31:52.519
that unwillingness to open their mind to judge things fairly

622
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:57.319
and consistentsistently. That exists for them there. It exists with

623
00:31:57.519 --> 00:32:01.359
this presuppositions and conclusions that people already had in their

624
00:32:01.400 --> 00:32:04.680
heads before they met Jesus. The religious leaders at the time,

625
00:32:04.720 --> 00:32:07.720
they had it in their heads a specific image of

626
00:32:07.759 --> 00:32:10.759
what they wanted the world to be like, without being

627
00:32:10.759 --> 00:32:12.880
open minded and say, wait a minute, I don't know

628
00:32:12.920 --> 00:32:14.680
what the world was like. Let God tell me what

629
00:32:14.720 --> 00:32:17.920
the world is like, right right. It's that open mindedness

630
00:32:18.000 --> 00:32:21.359
that suddenly resolves all of us. You see these conflicts

631
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:23.759
and you start understanding what's going on. But if you're

632
00:32:23.759 --> 00:32:26.359
closed minded about it, you just miss it. You can't

633
00:32:26.440 --> 00:32:26.799
see it.

634
00:32:27.119 --> 00:32:29.720
Well, it's like what we said earlier when we first

635
00:32:29.799 --> 00:32:33.920
started this conversation, Matthew is, the answers don't lie here

636
00:32:33.960 --> 00:32:37.160
on earth. They're in Heaven with the Father. He's got

637
00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:39.880
the answers. So if we refuse to connect with God

638
00:32:39.920 --> 00:32:41.400
and we think, okay, we got to do it at

639
00:32:41.400 --> 00:32:45.440
this you know, at the ground floor, you know, I'm reminded.

640
00:32:45.480 --> 00:32:48.319
In fact, we're just talking about it again this morning. C. S.

641
00:32:48.440 --> 00:32:51.880
Lewis says, aim at heaven and you'll get earth thrown

642
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:54.160
in aim at Earth, and you'll get neither.

643
00:32:54.559 --> 00:32:57.759
Yeah, you know, yep. And I So when I've gone

644
00:32:57.759 --> 00:33:01.519
out and I've talked to you know, Protestant interviewers, etc. Us.

645
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:04.160
Occasionally you'll reach a point in the conversation where they'll

646
00:33:04.160 --> 00:33:07.079
just say, well, I just trusted the scriptures, Like, well,

647
00:33:07.440 --> 00:33:10.480
you've already decided what the scriptures are. You're not asking

648
00:33:10.559 --> 00:33:13.160
God what are the scriptures? Like? You've got to be

649
00:33:13.200 --> 00:33:16.799
open minded and the understand that it is God who

650
00:33:16.880 --> 00:33:19.359
shares with us what the truth is. We don't know

651
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:20.519
it well.

652
00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:23.720
Well, going back in terms of prophecy, also the word

653
00:33:23.759 --> 00:33:26.319
says we know in part. We prophesy in part pretty

654
00:33:26.359 --> 00:33:29.279
much tells us we don't know it all right, and

655
00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:35.119
so which the Bible also says that when you have

656
00:33:35.279 --> 00:33:38.960
determined things in your mind with limited information, and you

657
00:33:39.039 --> 00:33:43.440
become ideologically fixed or or what the Bible might call

658
00:33:43.480 --> 00:33:47.599
a fool, then you know pretty much God says you

659
00:33:47.640 --> 00:33:49.079
probably don't want to have a whole lot to do

660
00:33:49.119 --> 00:33:50.640
with that person exactly.

661
00:33:50.680 --> 00:33:53.519
And it's just that closed mindedness that comes to you

662
00:33:53.640 --> 00:33:56.640
rather than, as you were saying earlier, that open minded

663
00:33:57.000 --> 00:34:00.839
pursuit of the truth that is outside of yourself it's

664
00:34:00.880 --> 00:34:03.920
just such a such a dangerous mental condition to put

665
00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:04.599
yourself into.

666
00:34:05.079 --> 00:34:05.279
Right.

667
00:34:05.359 --> 00:34:07.720
Well, and the thing is, I want to qualify the

668
00:34:07.799 --> 00:34:10.239
open mindedness because my old mentor used to say, Bill,

669
00:34:10.280 --> 00:34:12.320
you could be so open minded your brains fall out.

670
00:34:12.599 --> 00:34:14.440
Well, that's not what we're talking about here.

671
00:34:14.519 --> 00:34:17.320
Okay, you're open minded to seeing the evidence. You're not

672
00:34:17.360 --> 00:34:19.719
open minded to ignoring to the point where you ignore

673
00:34:19.760 --> 00:34:23.599
the evidence. You are open minded and accepting of what's

674
00:34:23.679 --> 00:34:27.639
out there, not as I say, ignoring something and saying, well,

675
00:34:27.760 --> 00:34:31.119
you know, it's sort of a ridiculous standard of proof

676
00:34:31.159 --> 00:34:32.719
that comes to people when they're too open.

677
00:34:33.559 --> 00:34:33.800
Right.

678
00:34:34.320 --> 00:34:36.639
And the fact of the matter is is that God

679
00:34:36.719 --> 00:34:39.880
shows us the evidence. He makes it real. Every day

680
00:34:39.920 --> 00:34:41.679
you wake up, you look out, and if you can't

681
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:43.239
see the majesty of God.

682
00:34:44.199 --> 00:34:46.519
And that I can tell you as part of the conversion.

683
00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:49.079
For me, I mean that is the eye opening experiences,

684
00:34:49.079 --> 00:34:51.440
Like just once that shift occurs in your mind and

685
00:34:51.480 --> 00:34:54.039
you start saying, well, oh my goodness, how did I

686
00:34:54.119 --> 00:34:57.559
miss this for forty years? But I did? And I

687
00:34:57.599 --> 00:35:00.159
was disclosed minded. Does anybody I just you know and

688
00:35:00.159 --> 00:35:02.239
see it? Didn't know it? And now that I do,

689
00:35:02.360 --> 00:35:04.440
it's like well, my goodness, it's right there.

690
00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:08.800
Right, And then what a difference for you. And we've

691
00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:12.119
all been there, Matthew, we've all gone through this, and

692
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:16.000
as I mentioned earlier, by God's grace and mercy, he journeys,

693
00:35:16.159 --> 00:35:19.280
he journeys us through and the fact of the matter

694
00:35:19.360 --> 00:35:22.639
is he's with us every step of the way. In fact,

695
00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:24.519
I was reading a story this morning and was sharing

696
00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:27.159
it with a friend of mine. You know that it's

697
00:35:27.320 --> 00:35:31.320
much like you know your dad as a child, as

698
00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:33.840
he's walking you and you're just learning to walk, you know,

699
00:35:34.199 --> 00:35:36.840
But as a child you just trust your father. He's

700
00:35:36.840 --> 00:35:38.760
got you by the hand, and he's not going to

701
00:35:38.840 --> 00:35:41.159
let you go to face plant. He's going to hold

702
00:35:41.199 --> 00:35:44.039
onto your hand and carry you through as you begin

703
00:35:44.119 --> 00:35:47.519
to develop your walking abilities and getting you through life. Well,

704
00:35:47.559 --> 00:35:49.960
it's the same way as our father in heaven, who's

705
00:35:49.960 --> 00:35:53.000
got us by the hand and he's walking us through

706
00:35:53.559 --> 00:35:57.320
to our final destination. And that picture it was just

707
00:35:57.360 --> 00:36:01.320
so comforting to me this morning to realize again that

708
00:36:01.400 --> 00:36:04.719
no matter what I'm dealing with, the Father has me

709
00:36:05.320 --> 00:36:08.480
by my aunt and that gives me hope, right.

710
00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:11.679
As absolutely, and as I say, when I look back

711
00:36:11.679 --> 00:36:14.360
on my life. You know, you just see these little

712
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:18.119
the string of events where the time that he you know,

713
00:36:18.239 --> 00:36:20.280
I was falling and he grabbed me right.

714
00:36:20.519 --> 00:36:24.239
Right, yeah before you face planet. Although all there and

715
00:36:24.280 --> 00:36:25.519
once in a while we can get a booboo.

716
00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:26.519
He's okay, exactly.

717
00:36:26.599 --> 00:36:28.159
You know that's how we learned, you know.

718
00:36:28.440 --> 00:36:28.920
My knees.

719
00:36:28.960 --> 00:36:32.239
But I didn't face play it right exactly. Well, let's

720
00:36:32.400 --> 00:36:35.119
let's review again the Catholic tradition.

721
00:36:35.920 --> 00:36:36.039
Uh.

722
00:36:36.599 --> 00:36:40.239
You know, the Catholic Church included these books that we're

723
00:36:40.239 --> 00:36:43.840
talking about, these apocryphal books, we'll use that term in

724
00:36:43.880 --> 00:36:47.519
its canon, and it was affirmed by earlier councils, like

725
00:36:47.559 --> 00:36:50.360
the Council of Rome in three eighty two a d.

726
00:36:50.599 --> 00:36:53.800
So this had been part of the Catholic tradition all along,

727
00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:56.039
right until I guess Martin Luther.

728
00:36:56.519 --> 00:36:59.920
Yeah. I The claim that the Catholics added the book

729
00:37:00.119 --> 00:37:02.519
does not added the books, does not make a whole

730
00:37:02.519 --> 00:37:04.119
lot of sense, to be honest, when you look into

731
00:37:04.119 --> 00:37:06.519
the history of it, they were already there, They had

732
00:37:06.559 --> 00:37:09.920
already been accepted by earlier councils, et cetera. The Catholic

733
00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:13.400
Church is just confirming what the facts were at the

734
00:37:13.400 --> 00:37:15.800
Council of Trent, and in fact they're confirming what the

735
00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:19.119
Council of Florence, which sometimes gets forgotten by Protestants, happened

736
00:37:19.199 --> 00:37:22.800
right before Martin Luther is born had already confirmed the

737
00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:27.239
books throughout history. So there is that the Middle Ages

738
00:37:27.239 --> 00:37:30.760
are a weird time. Books are very expensive, there are

739
00:37:30.840 --> 00:37:33.119
copies of Bibles that don't have the books, et cetera.

740
00:37:33.679 --> 00:37:35.920
Exactly what to make of all of that is sort

741
00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:38.679
of a bigger picture item of the future. But the

742
00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:41.199
key thing to me is the claim that the Catholics

743
00:37:41.199 --> 00:37:44.119
added the books doesn't make any sense. They just confirmed

744
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:47.519
what they've viewed as the history going all the way back.

745
00:37:47.559 --> 00:37:50.079
And then my book is, you know, confirming that they

746
00:37:50.159 --> 00:37:52.199
knew what the history right exactly.

747
00:37:52.679 --> 00:37:56.039
And of course, you know, some would refer to it

748
00:37:56.079 --> 00:38:00.360
as the standardization, which in reference to the Protestants sixty

749
00:38:00.400 --> 00:38:04.800
six books in their canon, which became standard after the

750
00:38:04.800 --> 00:38:09.639
British and Foreign Foreign Bible Society decided they decided to

751
00:38:09.679 --> 00:38:12.000
omit the Epocalypha back in eighteen twenty.

752
00:38:12.119 --> 00:38:15.440
I mean they decided. So my book, my book is

753
00:38:15.559 --> 00:38:18.760
laser focused on the specific thing, and it did this.

754
00:38:18.880 --> 00:38:21.599
But when you broaden that, you have, as you say,

755
00:38:21.679 --> 00:38:24.360
when did these books actually disappear in the eighteen hundreds

756
00:38:24.360 --> 00:38:27.920
and only for cost saving? You know what? What did

757
00:38:27.920 --> 00:38:29.880
the Jews think of This is a question I keep

758
00:38:30.159 --> 00:38:32.719
having and I address my book. But there are Jews

759
00:38:32.719 --> 00:38:37.000
that have accepted these books, never, never didn't accept them

760
00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:39.519
as far as we know the Ethiopian Jews. There are

761
00:38:39.559 --> 00:38:44.320
books that reappeared in Judaism later, et cetera. Like there's

762
00:38:44.440 --> 00:38:47.079
a whole history out there of things that could strengthen

763
00:38:47.119 --> 00:38:51.000
the case. But I am laser focused on just three things.

764
00:38:51.159 --> 00:38:53.280
What did the Jews? What does Jewish scholarship have to

765
00:38:53.320 --> 00:38:56.239
say on this topic, not Christian scholarship, Jews. What did

766
00:38:56.280 --> 00:38:59.719
the Jews say about these books? They confirmed the Catholic story?

767
00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:04.840
What did the apostles, the evangelists in the Bible say

768
00:39:04.880 --> 00:39:07.280
about these books? What are all those illusions back to

769
00:39:07.320 --> 00:39:09.920
these books? I present them all for any person to

770
00:39:09.960 --> 00:39:12.360
read them, understand what they are, and make your own decisions.

771
00:39:12.679 --> 00:39:14.920
And then the third is what did the early Church?

772
00:39:14.960 --> 00:39:17.440
I wanted to know what every single Christian through four

773
00:39:17.519 --> 00:39:20.000
hundred and fifty a d ever said about these books.

774
00:39:20.280 --> 00:39:22.440
I assemble all of that, put it there for the

775
00:39:22.480 --> 00:39:25.360
reader to understand it that's the piece that was missing.

776
00:39:25.400 --> 00:39:27.559
So to me, at the time that I was looking

777
00:39:27.599 --> 00:39:30.840
into this question, you would find Catholic books that cite

778
00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:33.239
a handful of quotes from fathers, and you would find

779
00:39:33.239 --> 00:39:36.519
Protestant books that quote it a handful of things from fathers,

780
00:39:36.559 --> 00:39:38.440
and I would be like, guys, I don't care what

781
00:39:38.480 --> 00:39:41.960
you cherry picked. I want to know what everybody ever said.

782
00:39:42.320 --> 00:39:44.039
Somebody's got to do this work so that I can

783
00:39:44.119 --> 00:39:46.480
read it. I looked all over the place for that book.

784
00:39:46.480 --> 00:39:49.800
It didn't exist. I have created it, and going forward

785
00:39:49.800 --> 00:39:52.000
to everyone now has it. You can know what every

786
00:39:52.079 --> 00:39:57.400
single Christian ever said about these books. That's the value

787
00:39:57.400 --> 00:39:59.719
that I'm bringing here, as well as all those illusions

788
00:39:59.719 --> 00:40:03.679
that I've found in Protestant Protestant Bible commentaries telling me

789
00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:06.639
that the Bible, that the New Testament is discussing these

790
00:40:06.679 --> 00:40:08.239
old books at certain places.

791
00:40:09.280 --> 00:40:10.159
See Licies and gentlemen.

792
00:40:10.199 --> 00:40:12.239
There is value in having an attorney in the house,

793
00:40:12.920 --> 00:40:14.519
you know, with this kind of giftedness.

794
00:40:14.559 --> 00:40:16.360
Only I mean because they.

795
00:40:16.199 --> 00:40:18.639
Are retired attorney who had nothing but free time to

796
00:40:18.639 --> 00:40:21.719
do this. That's a piece. It's a long time, and

797
00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:23.800
it took somebody with that interest in those skills, and

798
00:40:23.800 --> 00:40:25.400
that's that's right. What happened?

799
00:40:25.639 --> 00:40:28.280
Well, because the thing is, you know, as an attorney,

800
00:40:28.320 --> 00:40:31.559
and it's one thing to have tradition and a narrative,

801
00:40:32.320 --> 00:40:35.400
but in the legal field is it documented.

802
00:40:35.719 --> 00:40:38.719
And no judge in a case, if this actually were

803
00:40:38.760 --> 00:40:41.239
a case, no judge would have listened to either side

804
00:40:41.239 --> 00:40:44.039
of this. They would have said, guys, go do the work.

805
00:40:44.360 --> 00:40:46.119
Go in there and find me all the quotes and

806
00:40:46.159 --> 00:40:48.519
give me all the quotes, right, and this cherry picky

807
00:40:48.559 --> 00:40:50.840
would never have lasted. But it shows you that people

808
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:54.760
aren't necessarily always arguing or debating in good faith in

809
00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:57.360
that sense that they're not treating it as a real case.

810
00:40:57.679 --> 00:40:59.920
They're just making you said it earlier if they're making

811
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:02.559
the case to try to win, right, So they pulled

812
00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:04.559
out the handful of quotes that were on their side,

813
00:41:04.599 --> 00:41:07.920
and they're ignoring, well, what did all the other things say?

814
00:41:08.199 --> 00:41:11.159
No one did the work, and in fairness, it would

815
00:41:11.159 --> 00:41:12.960
have been hard to do the work before the internet.

816
00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:15.800
It took me years even with the internet. I you know,

817
00:41:15.880 --> 00:41:17.840
I'm not being judgmental that no one did the work.

818
00:41:17.880 --> 00:41:20.199
My point is it's not been done right.

819
00:41:20.519 --> 00:41:23.320
Well, well, I can't even thank you enough. And I

820
00:41:23.360 --> 00:41:25.719
told you this the first time I met you. This

821
00:41:25.920 --> 00:41:29.360
is just so awesome what you've done. You've done the work,

822
00:41:29.639 --> 00:41:31.599
and the thing is is that you removed it. You've

823
00:41:31.599 --> 00:41:35.000
taken it out of the emotional I mean, even like

824
00:41:35.039 --> 00:41:38.360
today and our debates that we have in our country today,

825
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:41.119
they're more emotional based than fact base.

826
00:41:41.519 --> 00:41:45.719
I invented a word, I decatholicize the discussion of the canon.

827
00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:48.320
So it's not a question of, you know, should you

828
00:41:48.360 --> 00:41:50.000
be Catholic. It's a question of whether you have the

829
00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:54.360
right Bible, period, full stop. Nothing else, and I quote

830
00:41:54.360 --> 00:41:57.320
nothing but Protestant scholars. I use Protestant lingo, I do everything.

831
00:41:57.360 --> 00:42:00.159
It's stop thinking about the pope. Let's just focus on

832
00:42:00.159 --> 00:42:02.519
the Bible. Right, do you have the right Bible? Let's

833
00:42:02.559 --> 00:42:04.719
look at the evidence. So that's my approach. I have

834
00:42:04.760 --> 00:42:07.000
found that Protestants love it. So if you are Catholic,

835
00:42:07.079 --> 00:42:08.920
I think you will love my book, and I think

836
00:42:08.920 --> 00:42:11.880
you will love sharing it with your Protestant friends and family,

837
00:42:11.920 --> 00:42:15.800
et cetera. But it is it is directed at Protestants

838
00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:18.000
to be as friendly to them as possible and show

839
00:42:18.039 --> 00:42:18.760
them the evidence.

840
00:42:19.000 --> 00:42:22.199
I can't imagine that Protestants would not be interested. Like

841
00:42:22.239 --> 00:42:25.920
you said, there's a natural curiosity in Protestants that it's

842
00:42:25.920 --> 00:42:26.679
even in their name.

843
00:42:26.840 --> 00:42:28.960
They protest right exactly, So.

844
00:42:29.519 --> 00:42:33.800
It's like, okay, here, here, let's protest about this, but

845
00:42:33.880 --> 00:42:34.719
let's get the facts.

846
00:42:34.760 --> 00:42:36.199
And the facts now are available.

847
00:42:37.039 --> 00:42:39.360
This isn't emotional, you know here it is you know,

848
00:42:39.760 --> 00:42:43.519
read it, you decide for yourself. So I can't imagine that.

849
00:42:44.239 --> 00:42:46.679
I mean, this may cause them a little bit because

850
00:42:46.880 --> 00:42:49.480
like most Protestants, they have five or six Bibles on

851
00:42:49.519 --> 00:42:53.719
their shelf right now, and none of them contain the apocrypha,

852
00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:57.280
and so they're probably thinking, okay, I maybe need.

853
00:42:57.119 --> 00:43:01.000
To The strangest reaction to me like it, I'm honestly

854
00:43:01.039 --> 00:43:03.559
surprised by it is how much the Protestants who've read

855
00:43:03.599 --> 00:43:08.159
the book end up loving the stories actual apocryphal books,

856
00:43:08.159 --> 00:43:11.360
the stories of Susannah and Judith and Tobit, and they

857
00:43:11.800 --> 00:43:14.519
they see connections to their Bible that they never really

858
00:43:14.679 --> 00:43:17.920
focused on before. Because again, these illusions that we're talking

859
00:43:17.920 --> 00:43:21.320
about are things that Protestant scholars are discussing and showing

860
00:43:21.320 --> 00:43:23.719
you where it came from. And now they see that

861
00:43:23.760 --> 00:43:25.639
and they just love that stuff. And I was not

862
00:43:25.679 --> 00:43:28.480
expecting that at all I was, you.

863
00:43:28.440 --> 00:43:32.159
Know, yeah, in your book, you open up, you start

864
00:43:32.199 --> 00:43:34.960
talking about Susannah. I mean it was like, you know,

865
00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:36.880
boom and hit you right.

866
00:43:36.760 --> 00:43:37.440
Between the eyes.

867
00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:40.880
That go okay, all right, So explain to our audience.

868
00:43:40.880 --> 00:43:43.079
We got about four minutes left here. Explain to our

869
00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:45.119
audience Susannah and how it fits.

870
00:43:45.119 --> 00:43:48.199
You mentioned my favorite story, our favorite story. It's a

871
00:43:48.239 --> 00:43:51.119
story about Daniel when he's a child. There's a woman

872
00:43:51.199 --> 00:43:55.559
named Susannah who is wrongly accused by two Jewish men

873
00:43:55.599 --> 00:43:59.400
who had attacked her, Jewish leaders, religious leaders who had

874
00:43:59.440 --> 00:44:03.239
attacked her and tried to force themselves on her. And

875
00:44:03.400 --> 00:44:08.159
she is being accused of adultery and wrongly accused. And

876
00:44:08.280 --> 00:44:12.559
Daniel successfully argues against it as a child. And so

877
00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:15.199
the question is whether this story belongs as part of

878
00:44:15.199 --> 00:44:17.440
the Book of Daniel. That's would be the debate over

879
00:44:17.480 --> 00:44:20.679
the scripture of it. It is my favorite story. It's

880
00:44:20.719 --> 00:44:23.960
a great story. It was accepted as scripture by every

881
00:44:24.119 --> 00:44:26.559
single father in the early Church for four hundred and

882
00:44:26.599 --> 00:44:29.679
fifty years. There is not a single exception. The guy

883
00:44:29.719 --> 00:44:33.280
who is frequently the closest to the Protestant Canadates, a

884
00:44:33.320 --> 00:44:36.880
guy named Jerome Jerome says, I did not reject his

885
00:44:36.920 --> 00:44:38.679
in it, and anyone who claims that I did, it's

886
00:44:39.119 --> 00:44:42.079
lying and slandering me. There's nothing in the early Church

887
00:44:42.119 --> 00:44:46.760
against Sutannah that comes later. And you know, it's an

888
00:44:46.760 --> 00:44:49.840
amazing story. It's amazing to see the evidence. And as

889
00:44:49.880 --> 00:44:52.400
I say, it could easily be a separate book in

890
00:44:52.440 --> 00:44:55.039
the Bible. That's how the sixteen eleven King James version

891
00:44:55.079 --> 00:44:56.599
sets it out. It could be at the beginning or

892
00:44:56.599 --> 00:44:59.199
the end of Daniel. But it's a wonderful piece.

893
00:44:59.440 --> 00:45:00.760
Yeah, one of those books.

894
00:45:01.119 --> 00:45:04.239
Why I dare say, we hear so little if anything

895
00:45:04.280 --> 00:45:05.800
about Yeah, And.

896
00:45:06.159 --> 00:45:08.239
Like I said, it's it's my favorite story once I

897
00:45:08.239 --> 00:45:10.840
got into it and it repere it's I you know,

898
00:45:10.960 --> 00:45:12.840
as a lawyer. Maybe it makes sense that it's my

899
00:45:12.920 --> 00:45:15.239
favorite story since it's Daniel kind of being a lawyer.

900
00:45:15.599 --> 00:45:18.960
But it is, you know, just a beautiful story and

901
00:45:19.519 --> 00:45:22.639
uplifting and you see God acting and saving somebody when

902
00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:23.639
they needed it.

903
00:45:24.079 --> 00:45:26.440
Well, Well, give us another. We got three minutes left.

904
00:45:26.440 --> 00:45:30.559
Give us another. Susannah's not Susannah, but another book and

905
00:45:31.000 --> 00:45:34.400
story that is part of the apocryphal Go ahead, Judith, Yeah.

906
00:45:34.320 --> 00:45:38.000
Judith is alluded to by Paul and his Epistle to

907
00:45:38.039 --> 00:45:42.519
the Corinthians. It is alluded to by Mary and Elizabeth

908
00:45:42.599 --> 00:45:44.679
as you you know, as women, you might expect that

909
00:45:44.760 --> 00:45:48.119
in the Gospel of Luke, and it is absolutely specifically

910
00:45:48.199 --> 00:45:52.360
mentioned by Clement of Rome, who was writing at the

911
00:45:52.360 --> 00:45:55.480
same time as the First as the some of the

912
00:45:55.480 --> 00:45:58.559
books of the New Testament are being written. He specifically

913
00:45:58.639 --> 00:46:01.000
mentions it and his Epistle to the Corinthians. So you

914
00:46:01.000 --> 00:46:04.280
have three people who might have been in corinth preaching

915
00:46:04.280 --> 00:46:08.320
to the Corinthians, Luke, Paul, and Clement referring to Judith.

916
00:46:08.480 --> 00:46:10.920
That is a mountain of evidence for the story of Judith,

917
00:46:11.280 --> 00:46:15.480
you think, And it's it's crazy that people haven't focused

918
00:46:15.480 --> 00:46:17.800
on how that is all tied to one city, one time,

919
00:46:17.840 --> 00:46:20.559
in one place and dealt with. But that it's also

920
00:46:20.599 --> 00:46:23.239
a beautiful story. It's about a Jewish woman who saves

921
00:46:23.239 --> 00:46:27.760
the Jewish people. Judith just means Jewish, So it's not

922
00:46:27.840 --> 00:46:30.440
necessarily a historical story as much as it could be

923
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:33.639
a historical fiction. That's what Martin Luther thought it was.

924
00:46:33.679 --> 00:46:37.119
He thought it was sort of a beautiful inspirational story,

925
00:46:37.159 --> 00:46:39.440
like job. Maybe it didn't happen, but you should still

926
00:46:39.480 --> 00:46:41.000
be reading it and it's still part of the Bible.

927
00:46:41.920 --> 00:46:44.360
But yeah, that Judith is another one that's fantastic and

928
00:46:44.400 --> 00:46:45.360
people love the story.

929
00:46:45.679 --> 00:46:47.119
Go ahead, one more, we got time.

930
00:46:47.400 --> 00:46:51.400
Tob Tobit is about has a lot about angels. In fact,

931
00:46:51.400 --> 00:46:54.840
the angel Raphael comes from Tobit. If you don't have

932
00:46:54.880 --> 00:46:57.400
Tobain in your Bible, you don't have Rafael in your Bible.

933
00:46:57.760 --> 00:47:01.800
And it's a beautiful story the healer exactly, and uh,

934
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:05.440
and several things that Rafael talks about in Tobit are

935
00:47:05.480 --> 00:47:10.719
then exactly the same as what John shows us in Revelations.

936
00:47:11.000 --> 00:47:13.840
So the idea, these descriptions of heaven and how heaven

937
00:47:13.960 --> 00:47:18.000
is organized and how it looks batch which is very interesting.

938
00:47:18.039 --> 00:47:21.559
You know, we believe that John saw into the afterlife

939
00:47:21.599 --> 00:47:23.599
and saw heaven and his revelation, well that seems to

940
00:47:23.679 --> 00:47:24.920
have happened with Tobot as well.

941
00:47:25.760 --> 00:47:27.599
Yeah, well you see what you got to look forward to.

942
00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:31.000
Exactly. It's fascinating stuff. Protestants have loved it, like I said,

943
00:47:31.039 --> 00:47:33.119
because they've never heard any of this. Catholics, at least

944
00:47:33.119 --> 00:47:33.960
you have his chance of hearing.

945
00:47:34.039 --> 00:47:36.559
Look at this, Look at this is the way you

946
00:47:36.559 --> 00:47:39.760
can get some insight from a retired corporate attorney.

947
00:47:39.800 --> 00:47:40.800
You don't even have to pay his fee.

948
00:47:40.800 --> 00:47:43.199
All you gotta do is bia his book, okay, because

949
00:47:43.239 --> 00:47:45.800
he's I mean, he's very expensive, as you can tell,

950
00:47:46.039 --> 00:47:49.880
and deservedly so, but here he's made it very affordable

951
00:47:50.239 --> 00:47:53.599
with his book, Canon Crossfire. Does the Protestant Bible blow

952
00:47:53.679 --> 00:47:58.920
up the Case for Christianity? Matthew Mark mccorter. Matthew, thank

953
00:47:58.920 --> 00:48:02.000
you so much. Really, you're such a blessing, and you've

954
00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:06.599
blessed our audience in bringing this to our forefront. And

955
00:48:07.920 --> 00:48:09.719
I know they're going to pick up your book because

956
00:48:09.719 --> 00:48:10.760
they're going to be blessed by it.

957
00:48:10.800 --> 00:48:14.440
Because we want the whole Gospel.

958
00:48:14.000 --> 00:48:17.440
We want everything that God intended for us to have,

959
00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:20.960
and you've opened up the gates to this.

960
00:48:21.079 --> 00:48:22.800
So thank you so much. I appreciate you.

961
00:48:23.039 --> 00:48:24.320
Thank you, God bless.

962
00:48:24.320 --> 00:48:28.280
Well, God bless you. Matthew mccuin, retired corporate attorney, former atheist,

963
00:48:28.320 --> 00:48:31.559
author of this book, Canon Crossfired as the Protestant Bible

964
00:48:31.599 --> 00:48:34.960
blow up the Case for Christianity. After a near death experience,

965
00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:39.519
Matthew launched a court room style investigation into scripture and

966
00:48:39.639 --> 00:48:43.000
what he discovered will shake your assumptions, and you got

967
00:48:43.000 --> 00:48:45.559
a little bit of a taste for it today. So again,

968
00:48:45.639 --> 00:48:48.119
thank you for sharing a part of your day with us,

969
00:48:48.119 --> 00:48:51.320
and thank you for Matthew for coming on and talking

970
00:48:51.360 --> 00:48:53.920
about his new book that's going to be a wrap

971
00:48:53.960 --> 00:48:56.119
for us. May God bless you and keep you, May

972
00:48:56.199 --> 00:48:59.039
make his face shine upon you, May be gracious unto

973
00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:00.679
you and give you peace.

974
00:49:00.880 --> 00:49:01.440
God bless