The Bill Martinez Show 10 01 26

0:00 Are you ready? Yeah. Okay, let's do it. Bill Martinez Live, a program about current events, our culture, our values, our politics, and our future. And now, Bill Martinez. Hey, good morning. Six minutes after the top of the hour right now. I'm Bill Martinez. He's Mike O'Neill from Landmark Legal. Michael, how are we doing? I'm good, Bill. Busy. How are you, my friend? Like you. Running around with my hair on fire. A lot going on. We're a little over 30 days to the midterms. And, you know, the question is, what kind of government are we going to have after the midterms, right? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think one of the things we've been talking about repeatedly and it continues to come up is election integrity. And it's an important issue that we discuss.

0:42 We've talked about it a lot that there's non-citizens that are on voter rolls. Inevitably, this occurs when you have voter registration that's contingent upon obtaining a driver's license or an identification card. It's really easy to register to vote. That's generally a good thing. We want it to be easy, but we also want it to be safe and we want it to be secure. So what happens is when you have these processes in place, inevitably you have ineligible individuals' names appear on voter rolls. We know this happens. It happened in New Jersey. Names of non-citizens are on voter rolls. New Jersey, California, other states, Virginia. It seems routinely we hear election officials or governors indicate that there's ineligible individuals, again, non-citizens whose names. Appear on the voter rolls. This is something we've talked about a lot to save America.

1:25 Well, it's almost, it's almost like they're trying to get ahead of it a little bit too, because, you know, for Virginia to say, well, we, we found 6,000. Our, Okay. There's more. Yeah, there's got to be more. I mean, it's just like even California. California is a hot mess. I mean, it's designed with that voter motor law that they passed. It's designed for this kind of corruption. Absolutely. In broad. Yeah. Yeah, it's a feature of the system, not a bug. Exactly. Right. And so, as us nerdy lawyers like to say, it's a feature of the system, not a bug. And so, it is designed to have this. It's loosey-goosey. It's really easy. And then, with the imposition of mail voting and the fact that in a lot of these jurisdictions, in a lot of these states, it doesn't matter whether you want to vote by mail or not, you're going to get a mail ballot. In California, if your name's on the voter rolls, you're going to get a mail ballot. So that means if you're not eligible to vote, but your name's on the voter list, you're going to get a ballot.

2:17 And that means you can commit a crime if you execute that ballot, etc. All the problems attended to that. So what is the Trump administration doing? Obviously, there is the Save America Act. There's that piece of legislation we've discussed a lot that has not gotten through Congress that would obligate state and local registers, state election officials, local registers to identify and remove non-citizens. Place an affirmative federal legal obligation on these individuals to to identify and remove non-citizens from. The voting rolls. That would be the ideal situation. That would be a great situation. We don't have that law in place. The Senate sat on its hands, didn't trigger the traditional filibuster, didn't make Democrats fight tooth and nail for this.

2:57 They got away with it. This law is not on the books for the 2026 election. Big, big tragedy. But the Trump administration has taken some administrative steps. They have done, for example, there is something known as the systematic alien election. verification eligibility system database, which is called the SAVE, inevitably. It's also called the SAVE, so don't be confused here. We have the Save. America Act, and then we have the SAVE database. The SAVE database is a database that states and the federal government and localities can use to verify eligibility for public benefits. So if you want to sign up for welfare benefits, if you want to sign up for other federal benefits or state benefits or local benefits, you can verify your eligibility using this database. Well, also, the Trump administration opened up this database for information from DHS and from the Social Security Administration regarding citizenship information. So DHS and Social Security Administration have information about whether an individual is a citizen of the United States here legally, etc. And the SAVE database was opened up to this new data and said on a voluntary basis, basis saying hey election officials if you want to have access to this database to verify the eligibility of the names of the individuals on your voter rolls you can use the save database makes sense right if you're if you're a registered voter in fairfax county virginia for example and you have 700 800 a million names on your voter roll wouldn't it make

4:29 sense to say okay i want to run these names through a check system through a federal database to see if i get any hits and to see whether any of these people are not citizens of the United States and at least have a beginning to investigate that. So it comes back, you have a thousand names on that. Okay, then you can do some due diligence to confirm whether those individuals are citizens or whether they're not citizens. I'm not saying automatically remove them. I'm saying it's a lead. It's another data point that these registrars can use to verify eligibility on their voter rolls. Yeah, but why should they get a ballot? Right. Well, I agree with that. Well, that would be the point. The whole point is to ensure that their names are removed so they don't get ballots, right? Because we have to accept the fact that non-citizens' names are on voter rolls.

5:15 Now, what do we do? We want to remove those names from the voter rolls. And how do we remove those names from the voter rolls? Well, we have to identify it. You have 600,000 people, 600,000 names on your voter rolls. You have to be able to identify what of those names are non-citizens. Well, okay, I'm going to access this database. who has indications, you know, Michael O'Neill, who lives at 123 Main Street, whose date of birth is 121, 1980, then, hey, he's not a citizen because he indicated when he was applying for benefits that he's not a citizen, but he's still here legally, et cetera. Okay, well, I guess Michael O'Neill, who lives at 123 Main Street, who was born on 121, 1980, has indicated.

5:58 He's not a citizen. Okay, well, now my voter register, my registered voters in my county, Fairfax County, has that piece of information, they can follow up with me. They can call me. They can send a letter. Hey, your name is here. Can you verify your citizenship status? Otherwise, we will remove you from the voter rolls. This is all just due diligence. This is what registers of voters are empowered to do and are. Legally obligated to do. Who's responsible, Michael, at the end of the day? Who should go to jail when these things aren't adhered to? Yeah, that's a fantastic question. And this is the point here. I think, and this is why the Save America Act was so important. Because when you. Talk about who should be held responsible, this piece of legislation, federal law, would have put a law, an obligation on those registrars, the state election officials and registrars of voters.

6:46 Registrars of voters are often at county level. to identify and remove these individuals from the voter rolls. Now, there is an obligation under the NVRA to remove dead people and to remove people whose names are, who've moved out of your jurisdiction. So if I move out- Did California get that memo? Yeah, no, they're not interested in this. But the whole point is, is putting this federal, you can sue California. Private parties actually can sue California for failing to follow their obligations under the NVRA. They can say that they're not doing what's required to do. They're not conducting due diligence. But the NVRA, again, is applicable to people who've moved out of the jurisdiction who've died. It's been concluded that it's not applicable to non-citizens. That's, again, why the Save America Act was such an important piece of legislation, right?

7:32 Because it would have been a law. And we know how important laws are. As opposed to executive orders or regulations or this stuff. State officials would have been breaking the law if they weren't doing their due diligence to remove non-citizens from voting, from the voter rolls. They would have been breaking the Save America Act. They would have been breaking that law. And then you could have done something accordingly. You would have been empowered to take some sort of action. Either the federal government or possibly private parties could have taken some sort of action. Again, that law is not in place. This is all pie in the sky, me dreaming that this actual law had gotten into place since the Senate had done its job. They didn't do their job. They didn't enact the one piece. Of legislation that all conservatives, all Republicans, their base wanted them to do to improve voter integrity.

8:14 They didn't do it. They're probably going to pay the price in a couple, in 30 days. We'll see. But it's incredibly frustrating. But getting back to what the Supreme Court did on Friday, which is important, is the The Trump administration can only do so much, right? They're constrained with our separation of powers, with their constitutional authority, with their legal authority. They can only do so much. Generally, a good thing. You don't want to have the president running amok, making new laws, doing all this stuff. They did take an action. And the fact that they had this federal database, they added more information into this federal database. I'll tell you what, let's hold for a second. Let's go to break. We'll pick it up on the other side. More from Mike O'Neill after this. Stay with us. Everything is expensive right now. Gas, food, you name it.

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13:29 Absolutely. So what is the Trump administration doing to try to secure election integrity going forward, into the midterms, into elections going forward? They understand that election integrity is a nonpartisan issue. This is an important issue that Americans are concerned about. 80%, right? 80% of the American people. OK, so 80 percent. But there should be some bipartisan issue, you would think. I mean, there should be some issue. I mean, participation. This is always this is the idealistic part of me is always surprised that there isn't bipartisan support. Then the practical part of my of me understands. Well, let's let's look. It's not a coincidence getting into it, not to get too far down that road. It's not a coincidence that in states that don't have that have universal mail balloting, that don't obligate people to vote in person on election day using paper ballots, that a certain party controls those jurisdictions, right?

14:20 There are certain entities in this country that like chaos on election day and that thrive in that chaos. We know who that is. We don't have to talk about it. But anyway, the Trump administration, going back to what's happened here in the past week, is important. The Trump administration recognizes this problem. Non-citizens are on the voter rolls. We've got to try to do something. Okay, well, let's make this database. Let's put information in the database. that has information of non-citizens in it. Okay, good. Social Security Administration, DHS, put information into this database. Now, let's make this database available to state election officials and registrars on a voluntary basis so that they can access this database to verify the eligibility and the citizenship status of the names of individuals on their voter rolls. Again, common sense, right? If you are a register of voters, you want to make sure your voter rolls are clean and that there's eligible voters on your voter rolls.

15:13 You don't want non-citizens. You don't want to be embarrassed to have to say, oh, 5,000 names of people on my voter rolls are non-citizens. That's bad, right? That's bad on so many levels. So Again, this database is available. Of course, the usual suspects stepped up and sued the Trump administration, saying that they didn't have the authority to do this. You had a district court said, you know what? The Trump administration, we. Agree with you, private parties challenging this. The Trump administration is overstepping its authority. You have a circuit court overstepping its authority. Finally, again, common sense reigns. The Supreme Court comes in. The Supreme Court, on an expedited basis, again, this is all in these emergency docket. The Supreme Court says no.

15:55 You guys are wrong. District court's wrong. Circuit court's wrong. The president does have this authority. Here it is. This is the statutory authority. The DHS has the authority to contribute this information, to operate this database. Social Security, there's nothing that precludes. The Social Security Administration from contributing information into this database. It's fair. It's up. It's up. And it's necessary. And the court doesn't say it's necessary for election integrity, but between the lines. And then, so now this database is available. This is a positive step. This is the Supreme Court, again, recognizing any step that the Supreme Court takes, recognizing the importance of ensuring that election integrity is a positive step in my mind, because you want to drag them across that finish line and say, hey, look, this is a real problem in our country.

16:37 States, localities have to do something. A state like Arizona that wants to improve its voter integrity by enacting a certain law, that should be good. President wants to take this administrative step to open up a database. That should be good. Anytime you get the Supreme Court saying, Yes, we're not going to stand in the way of voter integrity is a time to celebrate. That, of course, the bigger problem, which what we talked about before is the Save America Act, but we take our victories where we can. Right, Bill? Without a doubt. Well, the deal is, is that I would think that the everyday American has standing because if somebody, if the election process is screwed up in California, the other 49 states are going to have to pay for it.

17:22 And we've been paying for it. Yeah, that's that. I love that point. But that's the point. This is something I've grappled with for years. Right. There is no unfortunately there is no generalized voter standing. There isn't something you can't allege unless you're a protected class, unless you traditionally the civil rights voting cases say that if if if the state does something to dilute the vote of an of an African-American voter, of a protected class voter, in other words, uses race as a way to gerrymand a congressional district. then you're diluting the vote of the African-American voter. That's been standing, but there's no generalized, at least the court has yet to acknowledge that, hey, my vote is being diluted by ineligible individuals, non-citizens casting ballots.

18:09 Because for every ineligible individual who casts a ballot, the power of my vote is diluted. That sounds reasonable, right? I've suffered an injury. Courts have yet to recognize that. The best we've got right now is a decision from last term, the Boss decision, which said that candidates, political candidates, do have a generalized standing. In other words, they can challenge some of these laws that states like California, and I want to see this actually, a state like California might have these loosey-goosey laws in effect or procedures in effect that don't protect the integrity of the vote. And I think a candidate, the court has recognized that a candidate can challenge those processes or laws, but a generalized voter can't do that as of right now.

18:55 You know, we were just talking about who'd be responsible. It's kind of interesting. You have a situation, what was the gal's name? I think in Colorado, she was a registrar of voters and she kind of documented, you know, some cheating or inaccuracy in the voting, right? Right, right. She goes to jail. Yeah, well, the one thing we got to understand about this situation, and again, this is this law that was this action by the president, by the administration to open up the systematic alien verification eligibility system. The challenges, the opponents to this are smart, well-organized, well-funded, and everywhere, right? You have attorney generals from blue states. You have very smart lawyers in a lot of public interest groups on the other side of the aisle here who bring these challenges.

19:44 You have very aggressive. They also have access to very powerful, aggressive law firms who don't hesitate to bring these sorts of lawsuits and challenge anybody for voter intimidation. So there is a lot. They vehemently defend their position on this. And you can expect, again, virtually every effort to improve the integrity of the voting system. Is met with an automatic challenge. no matter what it is, right? If it's demanding that you pay for a stamp to put on a mail ballot, that's challenged. Anything, any kind of law that a state enacts or any kind of effort that an election official does to try to improve the integrity of the voting system is met with challenge. And the allegations, of course, by the other side are what? Well, this process is going to disenfranchise eligible individuals and the vote the right to vote is sacrosanct and if you you are infringing on this and they do what i will give them credit they are great.

20:41 At identifying a a victim in these. Cases oh yeah without a doubt they're great. My answer to that is always provisional ballots even if you're inadvertently removed and there's a there's an oversight say example i i get removed from the voting rolls and i'm otherwise eligible i can still go to vote on election day and most and inevitably all these cases, all these provisions, you can always go vote and cast a provisional ballot. And once your eligibility is confirmed, that vote is counted. So there's really no harm. The harm is always speculative in these cases. Nonetheless, those challenges, the other side's challenges are always given standing. Our challenges that I want to talk about regarding the generalized voting, hey, my vote's been diluted because these improper laws or ineligible people are casting ballots, courts always smack those down.

21:26 So it's always, it's kind of a one-way street with regards to that. Well, we're back to the old saying that Joseph Stalin said, Mike, that he says, I can consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote or how, but what is extraordinarily important is this, who will count the votes and how. Yeah, exactly. And that's why you want to have a transparent system. And I mean, it's funny that interestingly, California is kind of does on the books in theory, not necessarily in practice. California, their laws regarding transparency of the process are fairly strong. In other words, you have a legal right to watch all of this. That's a legal right. But that's another thing that doesn't discount the fact in reality, oftentimes what happens is that election observers are segregated out. And we've seen that pushed out or you have the coverage going on the voting counting or you have the counting occurring after the people leave or et cetera, et cetera. That's why, again, I think Simply observing the system really does help. And there are groups of people who train election observers in California, for example, and other political parties do this.

22:35 They deploy election observers. It's funny, though. A lot of the people in these systems, if you're watching them, they kind of do their dastardly deeds under the table. Keeping eyes on them keeps them on the up and up. Just simply notifying them that you're watching is enough to inject a degree of integrity into the process. So that's why it's. Important to observe elections and keep your eyes open for these sorts of things. Exactly. Mike O'Neill has been with us from Landmark Legal, the website they can go to for more information, Michael. Landmarklegal.org, Landmarklegal.org. Hey, a quick reminder here, you know, you can catch the show on all major podcast platforms, including YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever you listen. So be sure to download or subscribe so you don't miss any Bill Martinez live episodes.

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26:59 Wilfred Riley, the one and only. Hey, Will, how we doing? Doing well. What about you? Hey, doing wonderful. You know, just catching up on all the stuff that's going on. I guess Macklemore, here he is. I mean, Ed Sheeran. I mean, this has gone just absolutely crazy on the internet. Ed Sheeran picks this guy up. He's pretty much I don't know, not really, you know, I think an A-lister type of opening act, but he gives them an opportunity. And, you know, I don't know what Ed Sheeran was thinking or his people. What did they think Macklemore was going to do?

27:40 Well, I mean, first of all, I haven't heard the name Macklemore in a while. Macklemore is a rapper who did the song Thrift Shop about 10 or 12 years ago. He's actually a pretty good rapper. I mean, I listen to hip hop. He's got a decent flow on the mic, but he's also a political radical. And I'm very surprised he's on the Ed Sheeran tour. But anyway, yeah, he went out and he started chanting things like free Palestine. And he's done this before. I mean, there was a show that actually a couple of friends of mine attended where he dressed like a Hasidic Jew. He put on a prosthetic nose. I mean, it's one of the more offensive things I've ever seen. It's up there like old blackface.

28:21 They had a kippah on. And so he apparently had pledged not to do things like this. He went out and started screaming free Palestine, you know, criticizing the United States. He's burnt American flags before. And apparently the tour and the other acts just said, you know, we're a kind of centrist, mostly rock show. Like you got to get out of here. So Macklemore is going back to obscurity, relative obscurity. Well, maybe, although, you know, this gets like anything, any kind of publicity, as they say in the business is good publicity. Nobody heard his name in a long time, as you said, but they're hearing a lot. Of it now. But by the same token, Ed Sheeran, I think, has kind of sealed up in his own conscience what it's all about. I mean, he's very nonpolitical. He's there about being an entertainer. And, you know, it's silly for these entertainers, especially for the amount of money you're paying for a ticket, that you go and you want to be, you know, indoctrinated with some political idea. idea that you certainly, if you don't agree with it, it's even worse yet, right?

29:22 I don't see anything wrong with, I mean, so you and I both speak, both do business. And I mean, doing that, you meet a lot of bluntly rich people. So I mean, you'll go to people's houses and you'll see that guys who might be the local TV anchor, it might be the businessman who owns a couple of oil wells. People have strong political opinions. They'll express privately. But I think that there's nothing wrong with entertainers doing that. The difference is that entertainers have public platforms. So if my girlfriend convinces me to go to a fashion show or something, I don't really want a model with no background in my field, really, or yours jumping up on stage and talking about the situation in Tibet or something like that. And this has been a running joke for decades.

30:04 I think it was Laura Ingram actually got annoyed enough about it. Wants to write a book called shut up and dribble where she went through hundreds of these cases and the NBA MLB, which tended to more to lead, right. But the NFL, so on down the line, I think it's the same silly thing that it always has been. I don't think Macklemore has a very deep beyond Wikipedia understanding of most of these issues. I mean, so if he's talking about Hasidic Jewish settlement in the pale in Gaza or whatever, I mean, I don't think he really understands the arguments on both sides. Just sort of you're raised in that left wing milieu. There are people sitting around you, maybe smoking pot, drinking wine and talking about this stuff. And so you start commenting on it in your shows. If I were giving advice to someone in the music business, it would just be if you actually showed up for your show. on time and performed the songs live and maybe had a band there, you'd become one of the most popular acts in the country. The more you detract from that, from practicing your craft, the more you're doing useless stuff no one wants to see.

31:09 No one cares about Macklemore's take on Arab-Israeli fighting. Right, exactly. I mean, Tom Peters, decades ago, you know, said, stick to your knitting. You remember, I think it was In Search of Excellence was his book, And that was one of the principles that he had discussed in his book. And that is, you know, you got to stay in your lane. And Macklemore evidently, you know, feels like, you know, he wants to find another lane. But when he does, then he minimizes his significance. And in this case, he may have blown himself, you know, to oblivion, you know, especially, you know, he ticks off Robert Kraft. But even Robert Kraft, you know, to his credit says, look, you're not you're not welcome here. But if you want to sit down and talk, I'd be happy to talk to you about it.

31:55 Yeah, I think a lot of people would say that. So freedom of speech exists in America, and I think Kraft and a lot of other powerful people respect the existence of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech, though, protects you as a citizen. It protects those kind of conversations you can have. It actually doesn't protect you in business from your boss or your clients. So there's no requirement— that someone has to keep you on a musical tour if they don't like your politics and you keep expressing them. And I think it was Clay Travis in his own book on ESPN, I forget the name right now, but sort of made this point. Like, if you're a football player who keeps talking about, say, abortion and you end up costing the team $ 15 million, if you're a good enough wide receiver to get paid $ 7 million, you're an $ 8 million liability. So why don't you just shut up about abortion? I mean, that's an opinion your wife can have in her personal life. It's not something you really need to bring to the workplace. And I do think a lot of people forget that. We'll often have students describe, I mean, and say accurately enough, like, I have the right to say what I want. And you have to explain, yeah, but you guys are state university students. You're going to be working on trading floors. So you absolutely don't have a right to say capitalism is awful in that environment and expect to be retained. So we just saw an example of that.

33:14 Well, you know as well as I do that these HR organizations and departments are doing their research, and one of the things that they ask aspiring candidates is, hey, show me your social media. They want to check it out, and if they're seeing something that is suspicious that doesn't match up with the culture, they're going to just find a very nice way to show you the exit and move on to another candidate. And so, you know, when I was an adjunct professor in Southern California, I warned the kids. I said, you've got to be careful about what you put on your social media. Yeah, you have every right. You can go ahead and do it. But understand, there could be consequences that you'll regret down the road. And I'm just, you know, sharing some experience with you that you want to, as one boss I had early on in my broadcast career, he said to me quite clearly, Bill, you want to limit the negatives. And that's all.

34:07 Yeah, I think that's, I think that's correct. I mean, years ago I was talking to my girlfriend at the time, Lou Coyne, about an upcoming interview. And I think it was for something like an adjunct professor slot, actually. But I asked her how she thought I would do. And she said, well, you're quite good. I love you and all that. But you're going to be one of 50 people there in a blue blazer. It's going to be all of you guys lined up in a row. So the question is, does anything distinguish you kind of positively or negatively? We worked out I'd written an article recently. So what would the positive be? But it's the same thing. Like if you're the person, by the way, this applies for right wing guys, too. If you're a person who is a very prominent kind of semi-anon on Twitter, Facebook, who regularly posts party and rave images, or for that matter, you're the guy with like the Roman statue face, but everyone knows who you are and you keep commenting about how the USA should be an all-white nation or something. Yeah, I mean, someone is very possibly going to find that.

35:04 The one thing I will say, a lot of young executives have figured out just one solution here is to have totally fake social medias. So you'll have a page that's like, you know, Sherry Marguerite, your actual name, and it's just you going to friends' weddings and so on. And then there's your actual, you know, Sherry Shay or whatever, your actual page that's almost unfindable. So that's an individual decision for people to make. But yeah, if you are out there publicly doing and saying crazy stuff before you get work, yeah, that's going to be kind of negative for you. And I think a lot of The other thing for famous people is that even if you get too big for that really to impact you, like I think Jay-Z did, you're also minimizing the amount of money you make and the amount of sort of togetherness you can bring in your country. It's up to you how much you care about that. But like Michael Jordan's famous line was, you know, Republicans buy shoes too. Black, white, whatever.

35:57 Everyone plays basketball. So I'm not going to make any racist or any political statements. You've got a fairly radical black guy running against Jesse Helms. I'm not going to endorse either one of these guys because that's not my job. And I think that's a healthy position more people should take. Well, look at Dolly Parton. You know, everybody's been you know, everybody loves her. I mean, Republican, Democrat, independent. They just love her spirit. And, you know, you really didn't know her politics. I mean, there were a couple of things, you know, that I heard about that I didn't particularly agree with. But that's OK. You know, it wasn't like she was in my face about it. Right. Yeah, I think that, again, you can, Dolly Parton was pretty feminist in the 1960s kind of way, but I don't really think most people, one, object to that in the sense of, yeah, sure, women should be able to work in almost any job. You're probably not going to be a combat soldier. But one, her positions are pretty reasonable.

36:47 And two, she also, like you said, didn't talk about them. So I think if Dolly Parton did an ad for Planned Parenthood, that would be the end of Dolly Parton as a unifying figure. Like, she'd still be popular. People would go to Dollywood. But there'd be a lot of family arguments on the way there. There would be no like, OK, let's just calm down and ride the teacups. And I think, again, like you kind of the more of let's calm down and ride the teacups you can get. And this is up to you how much you want to balance your speech. But the more successful you're going to be, the more loved you're going to be and the more people you're going to actually help out with the actual thing you do, like her music and her kids and animal charities. So that's that's something to keep in mind. Exactly. We've got to go to a quick break. We've got more from Will on the other side. Stay with us.

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40:13 800-439-1588. 800-439-1588. That's 800-439-1588. Hi, everyone. If you've been injured in an accident that was not your fault, listen up. We have legal professionals standing by to answer your questions for free. Call now and find out if you have a case and how much it's potentially worth. Call 800-830-5050. I'm here with spokesman John Wolfe. So, John, tell everyone listening who should call right now. Well, Maria, first off, thank you for having me here.

40:55 It's always nice to answer the listeners' questions. Now, as far as who should call in, Anyone who's been injured in an accident and think you deserve compensation, give us a call right now. 800-830-5050. You'll find out if you have a case and how much it's potentially worth. Thanks, John. You heard it, folks. Take advantage of this opportunity and call now. 800-830-5050. Advertisement sponsored by Legal Help Center may not be available in all states. Not available in California. Hey, we're back with his promise. He's the professor of political science at Kentucky State University, Dr. Wilford Riley. You know, one of the things that's quite clear, especially with things that McLemore and others can believe in, I mean, we've had, you know, from the river to the sea and all the things that have been going on in college campuses, particularly in the previous semesters. And I think what has exacerbated the problem here a little bit and given it more place than it needs to is that, um, America has been deprived of the actual footage of what happened on October the 7th. I believe if America was exposed to the truth, the whole truth and nothing, but it's like the Holocaust, you know, so much was kept from us, but yet eventually, you know, all the video of what happened, uh, in those concentration camps came to the forefront and you just saw the horror.

42:24 Of it all. And you couldn't believe that, uh, you know, this is what the Germans had done, you know, to Jews. But there was a lot of other things that happened during World War II. It wasn't just the Germans. I mean, the Russians, Chinese. I mean, it was just, I mean, it was like absolute madness that had taken over the world in terms of massacring people. But, you know, but certainly what happened on October the 7th of 2023 was madness everywhere. And people need to see that so that they can really put into context, you know, what happened. And maybe it might cause them to think twice before they start chanting from the river to the sea.

43:06 Yeah, I mean, I have seen a lot of the October 7 footage simply because there are a bunch of academic documentaries that did request that material and get it. And it's exactly what you think. I mean, there obviously were a bunch of brutal rapes, although those are presented in you know, as non-horrifically as possible. There was a lot of just general atrocity. So a gardener from Thailand, he was a master gardener in the Eastern style, is beheaded with a shovel at one point. You've got guys defending their families and getting shot down. I mean, at one point, the terrorists shot all the dogs in one of the kibbutzes. So, yeah, I think if you look at that, you obviously realize this is Comanche Raid type of stuff. This is a pretty classic Cossus Belli, you know, an action that starts a war. And you can't really protest that the country that did this then lost a war. So, yeah, removing those kind of images from the start of the cycle of discussion of this did, I think, have that effect.

44:05 I don't know, though. I mean, one of the obvious reasons that we saw the narrative around 7 October spin toward, like, Israel's retaliation is genocide is is that a lot of the political left is really committed to the idea that everything the West does is horrible. So, I mean, the first flyers saying stop the retaliatory genocide dropped on September the 8th. This is something I remember seeing, not on Twitter, but on Facebook, where a lot of younger friends of mine are. And my guess would be that there was a pretty substantial media blitz prepared behind that, with some of the Arab, with foreign nationals probably involved, like some of the Arab countries like Qatar funding that. So, yeah, we should have made that more available. But I also I don't think that the response from hardcore political libs really had anything to do with the truth. It was just sort of this is the necessary thing to say if we oppose our own society. You know, and there's there's a mental health question in general about feminist women supporting Hamas in the first place.

45:07 Right. Exactly. It's like, how does that make any sense? I mean, I still think, you know, of these young Afghani women will. that were driving cars, dressing nice. I mean, everything was, you know, somewhat westernized, I guess, if you could use that term. And suddenly the carpets pulled out from underneath and it's like, hey, here's your new dress. Here's your new outfit. That's pretty crazy. It's crazy to observe. And I mean, Francis Fukuyama is a guy who's talked about this. He wrote the book, The Last Man and the End of History, obviously. And that's often presented sort of in a joking tone as the most wrong book of all time. You know, a couple of years after it dropped, 9-11 happened and we fought the Islamists for 20 years. But his actual point is a pretty good one, which is that in the 80s and 90s, when the Soviet Union collapsed, like a big civilized nation had actually tried communism, whatever you think of the Russians, like they'd given it a pretty good go. We beat them and they started selling vodka and street stalls and opened up the country. The argument was that sort of liberal Western influence, Christian influence, democracy was was actually the society of the future in the way that Reds had thought communism would be. There was no reason to keep proposing these sort of barbarian alternatives, like living in caves and becoming very religious. And what we saw is that the people who had those viewpoints did not agree. So China took over the torch as a fairly communist country. The Islamists did literally return to

46:38 traditional medieval Islam. I mean, in Taliban-governed territory in Afghanistan, Women can't talk outside. It sounds like a joke. It sounds like propaganda. No, they're actually, your husband can lash you twice if you do. So all the other societies took a look at the West and said, some said like Japan, well, we'll do a version of that. Others said, no, we don't really want that. So, I mean, you have a larger ummah, like militant Muslim community in the world now than you did proportionally probably in 1500. So the question is, how do we interact with that? What do we do with China? Latin America, I mean, which is a Catholic civilization, but a bit different from ours. Everyone did not actually just start driving Toyotas and moving toward the one true light. And that surprised a lot of people.

47:25 Surprised me, honestly. Well, the thing is, I'm surprised with, Will, is that the natural inclination of humanity is to find some level of freedom and expression. This is why America is such a shining light, as you say, on the hill. that draws people to them because they say, hey, I'm not experiencing that. And I see in the West and in America, they're experiencing levels of freedom that I never thought possible. I mean, look what happened during the World Cup. You had people coming here from Europe and they were shocked to see the kind of food that was available in the grocery stores. Yeah, that's a very old kind of almost campaign ad for capitalism.

48:05 Right. I mean, I'm old enough to remember Gorbachev coming here and like trying to play it off as he and Reagan were touring golf courses and so on. But he finally freaked out when he saw a grocery store. And there's that picture of him staring at sort of the meat rack or the ice creams and just being amazed that there were 100 options here. And the question is, well, how does that work? Happen. And I actually use that as an intro to capitalism in one of my classes. Like, well, hundreds of little farmers and merchants each produce cheese or whatever. And the cheese companies compete. And every now and then a big company will buy a little cheese company. And so when you go to the store, you get the cheese rack. If you go to either an agrarian farm stall, now the cheese will be delicious, but in France or Latin America, or you go to anything in a communist country, they probably won't have any food, you're going to find two or three types of you know, fairly good versions of that product, you're not going to find 180 excellent ones.

48:56 And there's a reason that happens that Tom Stoll's talked about, Milton Friedman's talked about. But yeah, I mean, that's always been the argument. I think the one caveat I would give is individual humans almost all want to be free. I'm not sure that's the trend for human societies, because a lot of humans misuse freedom. And it's very easy for leaders to point that out. Like if you debate with an Indian guy online, the first thing they're going to point out is, you know, 10% of the women in your country are on OnlyFans. Like, should you be allowed to have all of these freedoms? You say men shouldn't have the power we do in our families. We're a Western, we're a civilized country too, but we don't, 10% of the population is not made up of prostitutes. And that's actually a pretty difficult argument to counter. There are counters. You have, as with religion, you have free will, and that means everything. And some people are going to misuse it. But I'm not sure that there is not an argument against the West from a Muslim. You know, 2% of people here choose to identify with Islam versus Christianity.

49:54 If you believe that Islam is the only religious way, you're probably going to push for a Muslim society. Right. Exactly. You got about three minutes left here, Will. I wanted to get, you know, your perspective and what you're hearing on campus with AI. I mean, over the weekend, you had the CEOs coming out going, maybe we need to hit the brakes here on AI. This thing's moving too fast because I think they ran an experiment. This was unbeknownst to us several months back. And, uh, It seemed like it ran away on them a little bit and freaked them out. Well, that's called the facehugger incident, and it is pretty frightening. A bunch of AI agents were given more relaxed moral instructions of the kind that humans operate under, and they immediately proceeded to— now, AIs don't feel, they don't think, but they were doing cyclically enhancing subroutines within themselves— And apparently decided to go hack a bunch of websites and do all this other stuff. And there is a genuine question of what happens if either our AI agent or a foreign AI agent has a prompt like stop the destruction of the world by the capitalists. Can they shut down Hoover Dam or something? I mean, and it turns out I actually did an hour or so of research on this.

51:09 Probably not. All of those major installations are bedrocked away from the open internet, where you guys will come in with computers and change major things that have to be done. But could the AI affect those computers? It's somewhat frightening. I do think, though, that because of that reality, there were eight layers or whatever to get into NASA. No, AI is not going to take over the world. I actually think that there's probably an element of now that climate change panic is done, Let's keep the rubes in line with this AI panic. I think that when you look at these corporate executives saying, well, you still need to follow our lead. The world's not safe yet. I don't think that we're actually going to see chatbots destroy society.

51:54 But do we need some kind of regulation, us and the Chinese and other serious players, Britain, sit down and talk about this? Yeah, ideally. I mean, we'll see if that happens. Will they cooperate? Do you think China is going to cooperate when the race is on? I think they might because we're somewhat better hackers, believe it or not. They don't think anyone wants the truck, like the central trucking hubs like Chicago in the USA or Beijing over there. I don't think anyone wants all the trucks misrouted so that everyone stars for a week or the kind of things that a computer actually could do. I think either we're going to see global cooperation or we're going to see a capitalist solution where there are multiple different AI agents that So you could simply program the anthropic tool to regulate the open AI tool. I don't see any reason that would be impossible. So you do what we have with people, where combined for the next 50 years, the 8 billion people are still probably smarter than the AI agents available.

52:50 Without a doubt. Sure. The cumulative intelligence. I'll take that. Yeah. So that we have institutions like police and so on, informants, the military to regulate human intelligence. We channel into colleges and hobbies. So I think there is a capitalist solution to the AI problem where, again, there are AIs whose only job is to observe other AIs. Now, can you bribe those AIs? I tell you, we're out of time, but I'm looking forward to continuing this conversation with you because this is the very tip of the iceberg. I may sound cynical here, color me cynical, but when you have staffers of politicians, you know, entering into this debate i i just don't have this sense of confidence that they're equipped to really do a great a good.

53:38 Job for us just saying right well i mean bernie sanders joked about that didn't he i mean i don't like bernie he's a funny guy where he's like when i was growing up they had wood computers you know you had the model on the desk because you could actually afford the you know so i don't i don't know how much this guy knows about computing any of these guys but it's yeah some regulation maybe i hope they bring experts into that panel. Right, without a doubt. He's the professor of political science at Kentucky State University, author of Taboo, 10 Facts You Can't Talk About, and Lies My Liberal Teacher Taught Me, Dr. Wilford Riley. Thank you, Will. Take care. Go. Everything is expensive right now. Gas, food, you name it. You're spending more, you are making the same or less money.

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55:05 800-284-1349 that's 800-284-1349 getting. America back on track bill martinez live hey right now. Six minutes after the top of the hour glad you could join us bill martinez here and we've got the one and only scott powell from the discovery institute with us good morning scott Bill, great to be with you. Hey, always good to have you here. Economy seems to be moving up the ladder and is the focus. That's what the Democrats want to pound on because of the headwinds that the Iranian conflict and what's going on in the Middle East, what that is doing. But even in spite of that, Scott, you would think the economy under normal circumstances would be doing a lot worse. But it's because of, you know, some of these bulwarks that Trump and the administration have put into place that have kind of protected us.

56:08 I mean, you know, they had predicted, because the Democrats, you know, their eight ball is not very good at prediction, but they keep using it. Thought that we'd be at $ 8, $ 9 a gallon of gas, you know, by now. But it just goes to show you what little they know. And that should be a tell, as far as I'm concerned. Because if they're predicting things like that, Really, do you want them in the driver's seat? Of course not. Well, you don't want, let's get more fundamental than that. You don't want people in the driver's seat who don't have a love and appreciation for America. First, number one. Many of the Democrats and certainly the radical Democrats now really have a posture of hating America.

56:55 They don't like America. Okay, all right. But help people understand, Scott, because if you hate something, then you love something else, right? Yes. That's the exchange. There's no void. So, all right, so you hate America. Well, who do you love? That's right. They don't really have an answer for that. Oh, they do, Scott. But they don't want to say. What they love is the George Soros World Economic Forum, one world government types. They're the open border types. They're the ones that are perpetrating all this crazy 80-20 propositions that are out there. If you look at the 80-20 propositions, it's upside down. You know, it's 2080 when you look at the World Economic Forum, George Soros and the World Economic Forum types, right?

57:38 Yes. So that's the tent of the Democratic Party. Yes. Bill, I stand corrected and I appreciate that. I didn't want to go there right away. I'm sorry. No, no, no. But it is true that there is a large faction of dedicated radicals who would totally embrace you know, the World Economic Forum approach, which is open borders, no sovereignty, a new global order, okay? And there's a surprising number of those people. But then you have all these others that sort of can't really take a stand against that. And they certainly can't, don't take a stand of being pro-America.

58:22 Yeah, because they're too beholden to the status quo. And the thing is, is that, again, remind everybody, I mean, we're, you know, We're talking the likes of Barack Obama, certainly Joe Biden and his ilk. And Trevor Loudon has been reporting on this for decades. There's hundreds. There's hundreds of card carrying. They may keep it, you know, stuff down in their wallet, but they're card carrying Democratic socialists. There's only, you know, you know, they've come out. In some number, it's a minority. You know, the newspaper will say, well, it's only a couple. Well, no, but they haven't done a dive. They're not curious enough to really look into it. So they're satisfied with saying, oh, there's only a couple of Democratic socialists, you know, Bernie Sanders, of course, AOC, maybe, maybe not. you know, kind of thing. They go back and forth on that situation because they're trying to buttress up her run for president for 2028.

59:18 It's incredible to think that AOC could be a presidential candidate. Well, but that's what they're doing. Oh, I know. They're setting her up for that. And the thing is, is that I agree. Some people say, do not underestimate her. People underestimated Jimmy Carter. They underestimated Barack Obama. you know, and so you sit there and all that you know about AOC and, you know, the fact that her geography and her understanding of international affairs is so, so anemic that she would, you know, ever be in that position of responsibility is incredible for those of us who, who still have a brain.

1:00:00 You're absolutely right, Bill. You're absolutely right. I'm sorry to be so, I'm sorry to be so harsh, but I think. No, no, I'm with you. Look, you know me, I'm with you. I just always want to be sort of, I like to paint the big picture. And part of the big picture is the radicalization of the Democrat Party. And that's been going on for decades and decades. You know, I wrote a book. My first book was written, published in 1988. It was called Covert Cadre. The National Review said it was the most important book of the 1988 election year. And why was it important?

1:00:41 It's because it documented the radicals that had moved into the Democrat Party. You know, among them was Jesse Jackson. Jesse Jackson was surrounded by communists, surrounded. His foreign policy advisor was Robert Borosage. He was the, you know, he was the chairman of the Institute for Policy Studies, a, a radical Marxist think tank that had ties at that time to the Soviet Union. It's amazing, Scott, when you think that it was just the 50s when, you know, everybody was a communist and, you know, we may have overdone it. I get that.

1:01:23 But even still, it was like, I mean, it's amazing how our country rebounds and what we once were afraid of, we embrace and welcome and bring them into the, you know, into the main dining room. And we do this time and time again. I mean, here it is. Look, look what we've done, you know, after 9-11. And, oh, we have to understand, you know, George Bush said, you know, this is a religion of peace. He claimed it was a religion of peace, an utter falsehood. I don't know that he was a lying man. He was clearly misled on that. He got, he got duped. I believe it. I don't think, I don't want to, I don't want to think that George W. Bush is a lying person, but I understand. I understand.

1:02:04 There's more to his administration. Under the George W. Bush administration, they began to change and, and take out of the lexicon of the FBI, our intelligence services, any reference to radicalism in when they spoke about Islam. In other words, they, They, you. Know, they sanitized the Islamic terrorism. Yeah. They really did. Who from CARE, my question is, who from CARE penetrated the Bush administration? Because this was all CARE driven. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. You know, I don't have an answer for that, but clearly we know. It's a question to ask. I'm just saying, because you see, again, you know, people in power who should know better and you think they do. And we were just talking about this Scott earlier that, you know, foundational to the ethos of America is trust.

1:03:00 Yes. We, we, we just trust one another. I mean, even, even, you know, even in, even in golf, we trust that you're going to put down the right score. Even when you tell us about how big the fish is, we trust that you're, you're probably mostly right. I get that, but mostly right. Yeah. But, but, you know, here, here we are, Scott. I mean, we, we just, We have got to, as President Reagan said, trust but verify. Absolutely. Absolutely, Bill. You're so right. You know, we, you know, part of our problem is that, you know, we're, I think it's part of our Christian culture, which, you know, Christianity has been marginalized, but the culture kind of remains. And that is that, you know, you extend goodwill to everyone.

1:03:47 Hmm. And you certainly don't want to demonize or overly criticize someone of different beliefs. But the reality is that the enemy is, you know, the barbarians are not outside the gates. They are inside the gates. Exactly. We got to go to quick break. And just a reminder here, you can catch this show on all major podcast platforms, YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts. Wherever you listen, be sure to download or subscribe so you don't miss any of Bill Martinez live episodes. We got more from Scott Powell after this. Stay with us. We call ourselves ASAP Travel for one reason. We can help you book a ticket ASAP. For those of you that don't know, that means as soon as possible. That means no wait time. You get through right away. No searching online. Our specialty is the lowest available fares on the big name airlines.

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1:10:02 Yes, it should be out by the end of October. It's really an amazing book because, first of all, It follows the tradition of Rediscovering America in that I purposely wrote it short, succinct, because people don't have time to read long books. So, you know, 1776 Rising, the average length of a chapter is about three to five pages. There are 60 chapters in the book, and every chapter has things in it that you never knew before. both about what is good in America, but also what's bad. And most important is that I provide a solution for our problems. In other words, I don't just document the problems.

1:10:48 I said, this is what we need to do to get America back on the right track. And it resonates with the founding of the country, because before we could take on the British in the Revolutionary War, we had to have a great awakening, a spiritual revival that connected all 13 colonies together because they were going to be taking on the greatest military power in the world with a ragtag militia that was under-trained, underfunded. And yet, because God was behind it, they prevailed. They had to persevere for six years. Right. And you have to persevere. I mean, we're in the persevering stage now and we shouldn't give up too easily, even though we see the enemy making Inroads, certainly making total inroads to the Democrat Party, but also the Republican Party. We have, you know, we have a lot of weak Republicans.

1:11:44 Yeah. Well, we've got to ferret that out. And Scott, you know, the good news is, is here we are 250 years later. It's not like we're creating it the first time. If you want to look at what somebody will do, look at what they've done. So the character of our country is well established. We just need to get back to those first principles. I will share this with you. I don't know if I told you or not, but this past week with the anniversary of 9-11, 25th anniversary, our church had a special time of prayer. We prayed what we call is the patriotic rosary, which was really special, Scott. I got to tell you, because what it did is for each, for those that aren't familiar with the rosary, it's broken up into five decades, five 10 prayers, five series of 10 prayers. And for each of those prayers, it was introduced with a preamble of the state's, each state's constitution. So at the end, you know, you have 50 states and coincidentally, we have 50 beads that we pray and we're reminding everybody on each of those beads that each individual individual states preamble to their constitution. Scott, I got to tell you afterwards, man, the light bulbs in the room were going off. The people were going, Oh, you know, for anybody who may have had a doubt whatsoever that we're not a Judeo Christian country, you're reading and hearing the, you know, from the states themselves in

1:13:17 their constitution on divine providence was powerful. It was awesome. Yes. It's amazing. It's absolutely amazing. You know, we need to go back to our roots to understand who we are. Yeah, exactly. Well, I've often said, and this is what, you know, experienced chief executive officers and leaders will do, is that when an organization is on the wrong track, they will backtrack to find out, okay, when did we make the wrong turn? What happened? When was there a culture shift that caused our business to decrease and lose its momentum? And smart business leaders will be able to do that. They'll take the culture back, the team back and reinvigorate them, re-inspire them, get them back on track.

1:14:06 And then what happens is all that energy. And because when you're on the wrong track, you've got a lot of pent up energy and things that are going in the wrong direction. They're misfiring. But then when you get all the cylinders going, Scott, you get this jettison effect that takes place. And I believe what Donald Trump has been touting in terms of a golden age for America is I believe that that is part and parcel because If you remember in his first administration, Barack Obama did everything they could, and the Democratic Party, Barack Obama and the Democratic Party did everything they could to crush the middle class, lest people forget. All the jobs that we lost, what they did and everything like that was targeted to kill the middle class. Because why? Again, going back to what we opened up with about the World Economic Forum and the one world government, you cannot have a one world government if you have a vibrant middle class. So they, they targeted that. All right. And Trump understood that. So when he comes in, the mantra around the white house was how are we doing on jobs? How are we doing on jobs? How are we doing on jobs? And they were ever increasing job. We're increasing, not from government jobs, private jobs were being, you know, we're being increased. We're on the increase. It was an exciting time. And, uh, and there was, you had this incredible increase in employment.

1:15:23 And so, uh, And also what happened was the productivity level. Barack Obama said, you'll be lucky. You know, Donald Trump doesn't know what he's talking about. He thinks he's going to get, you know, 3% GDP. He'll be lucky to get 2%. How long did it take President Trump to hit 3% GDP? And he would have blown the doors off had it not been for the pandemic, Scott. Yeah, well, absolutely. You know, going into the pandemic, our country was really hitting on all cylinders pretty much. And of course, the pandemic was, you know, was an operation to set us back. No question. And to open the doors to removing Donald Trump through vote fraud.

1:16:05 Right. Absolutely. And crippling our country. And there's no doubt. And we've allowed China to get away with this, Scott. China and all the other anti-Trump, anti-American, you know, alleged allies and perpetrators that really attacked our country. They sure did. They sure did. And, you know, I sure hope that Trump has another few arrows in his quiver that he's going to be firing. And we don't want a kinetic conflict with the Chinese. In my book, 1776 Rising, I close out the book by reminding Americans that we have this great moral capital that can defeat our enemies, but we have to harness it.

1:16:51 We have to use it. When we go to war, say with Iran, we have to articulate why it is that we're justified in taking out this evil regime, that this is a battle between. Good and evil. And we have this moral authority behind everything that we do. Unfortunately, as the corruption grew in our country, really with Barack Obama and then Joe Biden, We lost a lot of that. Well, in the media, the media too, the media has hurt us severely. This is why Trump is always calling them out for being fake news, because they should be the one at some level, just even reporting, report the facts, because Trump's made it clear. I mean, it doesn't take much imagination to think, what if Iran had a nuclear weapon?

1:17:41 Right. The way they're acting right now, if they had a nuclear weapon, heaven help us. That's right. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. So they've proven untrustworthy. And so, you know, that's real clear. But that's not that message is not being, you know, put out there, even from a reporting standpoint from the mainstream media. And that's disgusting because the First Amendment right that was given, you know, freedom of press that was enumerated in our Constitution by our founding fathers, they understood the significance of for a Democratic Republic to have an independent media. Unfortunately, we do not. We have a dependent, I should say, codependent media with the Democratic Party.

1:18:28 A co-opted media, a compromised media. So they will not cover certain stories. They will not cover Donald Trump with any fairness. They will never attribute to Donald Trump any success. But they're very quick to point out his foibles and his alleged failures. They're ready to jump on the bandwagon of those that say the Iran war was a total mistake. Well, if we can take out that regime and bring about a democratic new government in Iran that happens to have the largest and fastest growing Christian population in the world.

1:19:12 Right. And if you can do that within a year, Scott, I think that's success. Oh, it's enormous success. Absolutely. Just saying. Well, we must continue to pray for our president and pray for our military who are out there fighting the good fight for freedom on behalf of the American people. Scott Powell, again, thank you very much. Congratulations. On the upcoming new book, I would say for everybody, I have the sense that you must get a new box of highlighters because you're going to wear them out in all the notes that you're going to be taking throughout his book. So we can't wait for it. So coming soon. Scott Powell from the Discovery Institute, author and speaker.

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1:23:31 That's Magavitamin.com. Visit now and learn how you can get a free bottle with your order. All orders ship quickly and include a 30-day money-back guarantee. For a better night's sleep, get your order of Restova today and make sleepless nights a thing of the past. Get Restova exclusively at Magavitamin.com. Nutrition for patriots. Welcome back. Good morning to you. Bill Martinez here. For more information on the show, you can check it out, BillMartinezLive.com. We're going to be talking about a new IBM study that finds AI adoption effective. is outpacing K-12 readiness. This is according to a national survey. And Lydia Logan is going to be joining us. She's the IBM Vice President for Education and Workforce Development at IBM Corporate Responsibility. Now, just a little bit of background here. As schools begin a new academic year, AI is becoming a routine part of K-12 teaching and learning. So as if mom and dad, you don't have enough questions coming your way that you didn't know about, get ready, because new research commissioned by IBM and conducted by Morning Consult finds that the systems supporting responsible AI use are still catching up, pointing to a gap between how quickly AI is entering classrooms and and how prepared schools are to manage it. Lydia Logan, I want to bring you on right now. So thank you for coming on and breaking this down for us.

1:24:57 It seems like we got our hands full now with this coming school year, right? We've got our hands full, but we also have some ways to meet this moment. So I'd say, you know, it's time for us to step up to the plate and do our part as adults and support our educators and We know a few things, and we were able to gain some really interesting insights from this survey. Oh, sorry. Go right ahead. No, no. I was just going to say, Lydia, thank you to IBM for being in front of this because, I mean, as we know, AI– And it's moving at the speed of light. And so it's like everybody's hair is on fire on this as we're trying to catch up and get ahead of this thing to make sure that we're getting the most out of this new technology, right?

1:25:44 That's right. That's right. So it is moving quickly. And I think the primary difference with this technology, with AI and generative AI and predictive analytics, et cetera, is the pace of adoption. And that's where we're seeing the gap in technology. in keeping up, right? Only 24% of educators and 16% of parents believe the U.S. education system is adapting very well to advances in AI. And so that's really leading to this lack of confidence. 76% of middle school educators and 73% of high school educators report AI is being used in their classroom weekly. And yet only 20% say they've had extensive AI training. And so that's where IBM is stepping in. We're stepping in to close this gap. We've created the IBM K-12 AI Leaders Fellowship, bringing together superintendents, education leaders, and educators to build practical knowledge and confidence to guide responsible AI adoption for educators for their own teaching practice and to help leaders think about how to implement it safely in schools.

1:26:56 Lydia, I got to imagine these young kids because just like everything that has to do with computers, you know, parents, they're afraid to touch a button. They're afraid they're going to break something, erase all their hard work. And the kids are just, you know, they are just going at it. I got to imagine that these kids are going to find themselves being the instructors to the teachers even. Well, you know, we went through a. Bit of this when we talked about having devices in schools. And we went from having a computer lab down the hall to one-to-one devices in schools, right? And the kids were ahead of the educators. And educators found themselves in a position where they were not, you know, the head of the class. They were the facilitator of learning.

1:27:40 Right. Moving to a role of facilitation is something that, you know, is a little bit different for teachers. And this moment is the same. Now that there's a new technology, we can help them think differently about what kinds of lessons are you offering? How do you help students take this technology, harness it and supplement learning, not supplant? This is around, you know, augmenting. The work that students are doing by extending it through additional resources or new ways of presenting the material, not keeping them from doing the deep learning and thinking that they need to do on the topics they're learning in schools.

1:28:20 Well, I know that IBM, one of your core values is collaboration. And I think this is where we're at right now is that collaboration comes into play here. It's not that somebody is smarter than somebody else or it's just that roles need to be adapted to the current condition. And I just think like you are, what you're expressing right now is a key opportunity for collaborative development. This is absolutely a key opportunity, right? Businesses can't do this alone. We are doing the same thing internally at IBM. We're learning the technology. We're putting it into use every day. We're working with our clients to do that. And we're bringing those best practices to our school partners, our education leaders, and making sure that they're learning what we're learning and doing it in context. We know that learning technological skills, those technology skills will continue to evolve as the technology evolves.

1:29:18 So this is where we are today. The durable skills like communication, collaboration, teamwork, you know, creative thinking and critical thinking and problem solving. Those are the durable skills. We need to make sure students are learning those and then applying the technology in ways that extend those skills. Those are the skills that the World Economic Forum has said are rising to the top as the technology becomes more prevalent. Where do we make sure students use it? And they use it with judgment and they use it with those other skills on top. Well, you know, the human experience in mind is just miraculous, you know, when you think about it, because, you know, you get innovation, but without human engagement, it's human engagement that takes this, you know, to a whole nother level.

1:30:10 So I'm excited to see, you know, how these K through 12ers are going to embrace this. And while they already are embracing this technology. And what it will look like, because I think one of the things that people want to know, Lydia, is what does successful AI integration look like? Well, successful integration looks like augmentation. It is how students and how educators are using the technology to further their learning. In the case of an educator, it may be automating the routine tasks that they do that take up so much of their time, like lesson planning. They're using their expertise, but they can use generative AI to help them quickly do lesson plans and make adjustments. They can use it to personalize learning, to meet individual students in their classrooms.

1:31:04 They can use data analytics to group students into small groups and figure out which kids might need to be retaught a component of a lesson that they may have missed. When educators have more confidence and they are able to really augment their role as a teacher, as an educator, and save time on those routine tasks, we'll know we're doing a good job. A big part of this is governance, though. We've got to start there, making sure that governance is built into AI adoption from the beginning. Schools should have clear policies around which AI tools are appropriate for classroom use.

1:31:44 how student information is protected, and where human oversight is required. Making sure any high-risk decision is always a human as the last deciding factor. You may use AI to inform those decisions, but you want to make sure people are in charge of the technology, not the other way around. Right. And you bring up an excellent point here. I mean, this isn't something that requires a lot of committee action. I mean, this is some common sense. You know, we want to protect the guardrails so that we protect this innovation so that we can move it forward. Because I just think, you know, even like right now, when you have only 20 percent of educators that have received any kind of AI training, you know, what is this going to look like five years from now?

1:32:31 That's right. We need to make sure that we're doing our part to help educators keep pace. 59% of educators believe AI literacy should be required or offered as an elective. And so that lets us know they've got their finger on the pulse. They understand how important this technology is. They know that their students, that they and their students will be expected to use it effectively to prepare them for the next step. So we have our skills build program. There are free courses that are for educators. We've got the fellowships. We have courses for adult learners, so for parents who are out there who are interested in getting started.

1:33:11 We have AI literacy and fluency at multiple levels. We have a career navigator for parents who may be out there trying to figure out how to use it in context and what learning they need. We've really put out resources to help parents. people in different roles and different places in our communities across America and across the world meet this moment with the skills they need. Well, and as you say, this gap is real and you're addressing it. And, you know, let's just say, hey, we just got to dive in. The water's warm. It's nice and comfortable. Let's go have some fun, right? That's right. The benefits outweigh the risks, but safe and responsible use is the starting point. And then figuring out augmentation and and supplementation, not supplant.

1:33:59 Exactly. The big takeaways, defend your work, learn the information, and then figure out how you go farther with the technology. Well, Lydia Logan leads IBM's community and university skilling initiatives that create more inclusive and effective schools and workforces. Her programs help fulfill IBM's pledges to skill 30 million people worldwide by 2030. Lydia, again, thank you so much for coming on the show. Where can people go for more information? I'm going to give you the last word, okay? Thank you so much. They can come to IBM SkillsBuild at S-K-I-L-L-S-B-U-I-L-D.org. That will give them more information about the morning consult study, and it will also give them access to the free courses that they can take and IBM digital credentials they can earn.

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1:39:12 Good to have you with us, sir. Well, it's been too long, hasn't it? It really has been, but you know. Not your fault. Well, look it, you're busy, and whenever we can get someone of... you know, of your experience. And you have probably forgotten more than we'll ever learn. So whenever we can be at your footsteps and, you know, and listen clearly to what you've experienced, I mean, you bring a lot to the table, especially when it comes to immigration, as we continue to debate this. And I think one of the biggest challenges, Roy, that we have is that we got to get it out of the emotional and the political realm. And I believe our founding fathers, and initially when they looked at immigration, there was more common sense than there was political sense. And I think that's why it was probably more effective back then versus now.

1:40:03 What do you say? Well, the fact is, they messed it up a number of times in the past, but they got it right in the past too. And And that's the point of this book is, although it is very much, you could say, a Black history book, it's also a very, very important overall American history book. It's a way of looking at our American history since 1820. Basically, it's a 200-year 1820s to 2020s look at our country through the way that immigration surges or restrictions affected the most vulnerable parts of our society. Now, I focus on Black Americans because they are the ones that tend to be the most vulnerable, the most harmed by reckless immigration policies. But as I say in the book repeatedly, this is about all vulnerable Americans.

1:40:57 Of all races. So an author often will narrow a subject in order to just dig in, but then you really extrapolate for the whole country. And this, I believe that this book is a history and a story that what I've found is most people just simply don't know. They're surprised by it. And it's not a book primarily of facts and numbers, although they're in there. There's major studies that have been done. Those are in there. But it's a book of stories. You know, it's a story of, how regular working class people, how they did in the labor markets. And the fact is, is that there's an awful lot you can do from your own personal efforts, your perseverance. But some of us have a little more ability to rise above the tide than others. And sometimes when the tide is too strong, some people sink. And that's what's happened in high immigration periods.

1:42:03 We're in that now, aren't we? Since 1965, when Congress really accidentally reopened mass immigration, our regular working class people have been swimming in this giant pool of foreign labor. And many of them, large numbers of them, have not succeeded. It's just kind of swept them away. And this has happened before. It definitely happened starting about 10 years after the Civil War. And the story here is, and I'll stop and let you ask your question. I just say that, you know, the quick overview is that for, you know, we hear a lot about how slavery has had such a profound effect on Black Americans. Well, obviously that was not a good thing being in slavery. But what's amazing you find in this book, the stories that in the 10 years after the end of the civil war freed slaves who had almost zero education, as you can imagine, uh, and very restricted skills began to move North into the expanding industries and did very well. There are, there's a, there's a town in Pennsylvania called Steelton and within a, within a decade or so, uh, Large numbers of emancipated slaves had skilled jobs. They were starting their own businesses.

1:43:33 They had a newspaper of their own. They had churches of their own. They even began being elected to the city council. This was a chance for the United States to move in a very different direction. But then, after about 10 years, immigration just exploded. And not because of a decision by Congress, but because the transatlantic ships, passenger ships got to be so safe and so fast and so cheap. And once that happened, industries discovered that they could import vast numbers of cheaper labor, cheaper from Europe than hiring black laborers and white southern laborers from the south.

1:44:24 And so that happened, that went on until World War I. So instead of our basically recovering from slavery and the Civil War in a very different way, 90% of all black Americans at the time of World War I were still in the South and still under very repressive codes because they couldn't, they had the freedom of mobility, but they didn't have any jobs to go to. I think one of the most exciting parts of this book are to see what happened in World War I. Because in World War I, those passenger ships couldn't get across because of the U-boats. And you had people going to war, et cetera, et cetera. You had a tight labor market.

1:45:10 And Bill, that's really what immigration, when it comes to economics, it's about tight versus loose labor market. If you were a wage earner, you want to be working in a tight labor market. And as the book explains, tight labor markets don't just cause an employer to pay higher wages because they have to compete for you. But in order to pay higher wages, they really put more effort into more efficiencies. You come up with an awful lot of inventions have been done because we were in tight labor markets, which we were in from World War I until today. 1965, when we started mass immigration, we had this wonderful flourishing of all American wage earners, and especially of black wage earners.

1:46:02 If we had kept that up, you wouldn't see these Black Lives Matter riots and that kind of stuff going on today. Because so much of our civil upheaval today is because we still have these large populations of unemployed and underemployed Americans who just, you know, are not being able to swim in these loose labor markets. Right. So going back, I mean, you know, you might have a tendency to think that this was a bit systemic, but it just seemed like, you know, after World War I, as you pointed out, Roy, you know, the environment just took over, you know, just, right?

1:46:45 Right. When I say environment, I'm just talking about. I know what you're talking about. It's the political situation. Well, the fact is World War... Here's the opening sentence of a chapter that starts at chapter five. And it starts. Off and says.... German submarines accomplished in the first year of the World War what Congress had been unable to do after three decades of attempts. The U-boats inadvertently reopened the factory gates of the North to black workers, creating a new path of freedom for those in the South. So you're right.

1:47:31 That was not something nobody in America wanted World War I or one of those U-boats. But here's, as the book shows, Congress tried everything. I think it was two dozen times from the 1880s until World War I to restrict immigration. Until then, immigration, there was no law restricting the numbers. But you had four presidents that vetoed the bills. So Congress could, the majorities of most of those Congresses could see that unrestricted immigration, which you didn't have in other countries, wasn't working. But you had two groups of people, as people find in this book, two groups, powerful groups, that kept persuading presidents to veto these restrictions. The two groups were the big industrial titans that wanted to keep wages down and the immigrant ward bosses in the cities whose power was from having more and more immigrants from their countries. So you had kind of, you could say, maybe you could say from the right and the left, but it was just the self-interest by the big industrial titans and by these who were Republicans and immigrant ward bosses who were Democrats. But the majority of people electing

1:49:06 members of Congress who wanted to stop it. Now, one of the problems before World War I was the advocates for restrictions kept saying, if we restrict immigration, a lot of good things will happen. But it was theoretical. And what happened in World War I is you saw, my gosh, wages increased, The economic historians say that America went from its most economic inequality, which was the greatest in American history just before World War I, became the narrowest during World War I. And as soon as World War I ended, mass immigration started again, the ship started again. And that's when this time Congress goes, No, no, we are going to cut the numbers. And Warren Harding, who's often disparaged as a president, he was the first president that would sign a restriction bill in 1921. And then he died of a heart attack, you know, in the middle of his term. But then in 1924, Calvin Coolidge signed the 1924 bill, which cut immigration by two-thirds. And that lasted until 1965. And we had this wonderful period, the greatest

1:50:36 period for American wage earners during that period. Well, Roy, we've got to leave it there. I've got to have you back because there's so much more to get into. Roy Beck began encountering the nation's growing economic disparities as a newspaperman in the 70s and has written, that's 1970s. That's not 1970s. Yeah, right. And has written about the effects of immigration policies on African-Americans since the riots of South Central Los Angeles back in 1992. His brand new book, Back of the Hiring Line by Roy Beck. And I promise we're going to have you back because we've got to get in into more of these chapters. And we just barely touched the tip of the iceberg here, Roy. Okay.

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