The Time of the Signs: A Chronology of Earth’s Final Events

0:00 The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services, or products mentioned on air or on our web. No liability, explicit or implied shall be extended to W four c Y Radio or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing W FOURCY Radio. Well, hello and welcome. This is Bill Martinez and we are live. You know, even if you have just a cursor re understanding of the Word of God, you're looking at what's happening around the world today and going what is what is happening with our world? You know, we've got wars, warmors or wars. I think it's reported now that we have something like the thirty two wars happening around the world right now, believe it or not. We see disruptions in the climate, if you want to say, in the skies. The signs are giving us some indications and causing people to look up. I think it's interesting that the knee jerk reaction is that people would look up, I go, what are you looking up for? You know, it's like they're looking up for an answer that they know cannot be found at this level and on this ground. Well, our next guest is a recognized authority on Bible prophecy. His new book called The Time of the Signs of Chronology of Earth Final Events. So if you

1:33 have questions in your mind and you've been thinking about some of these things, this is a perfect show for you to be watching right now. Barry Stagner joins us. He's adopted a rigorous approach, grounding his ascertations in the scriptures while examining contemporary global events in his book In the Time of the Signs. This balanced presentation avoids the frequent air of imposing modern circumstances onto biblical narratives. The book addresses a range of important subject including Israel's role is God's time piece, the promise of the Rapture, and a prophetic understanding of armageddon. Barry Stagner, Welcome to the show. Good to have you with us. Bill, It's great to be on with you. Great to have you back and to be talking to you again. Barry, congratulations on this book. This is a book that for some reason I just sensed that you were waking up in the middle of night many times, you know, thinking about, you know, the signs of the time and even thinking, well, how do maybe I need to look at it a little bit different, look at the time of the signs, right, yeah, you know, Bill, it's interesting. And Daniel twelve four, Daniel was told to seal up the series of visions that he received, for they were basically reserved for the time of the end. And you know, he was told that knowledge will increase at that time. And we are living in that time where things said even the one who held the pen and didn't understand them, and now we're seeing them happen. And we truly are living in a time of the science, which

3:06 in and of itself is one of the prophecies that we're watching be fulfilled exactly. And you talk about how knowledge is so readily available, the Internet being what it is, you know, so much power is in our hands. I mean, there wouldn't even have been enough encyclopedias, you know, to cover the information that is available on our cell phones today. Right. Well, you know, it's funny when you go back to the creation of the supercomputer, you know, the general feel was there'd be a need for about four or five of them in the whole world. And now we've got more information tucked on our phones than the first supercomputers had that the few who understood it could access. And you know, it's interesting, Bill, as I travel around and speak on prophecy, one of the things that I cover as a subject is that we have transitioned through time, you know, through the Stone age and the iron and bronze and all these other labels that we've thrown at it. But we have now moved, I believe, from the industrial age, the atomic age, the information age, and now we're in the misinformation age. Yes, so much presented it's just false Bible prophecy. What is it about Bible prophecy that has just caught your attention and will not let you go? Well, you know it was instrumental in me coming to faith in Christ. So I was raised in a church, a wonderful Christian family,

4:41 godly parents, just the ideal situation. But I was raised in a church, a denominational system that didn't talk about this kind of stuff. And so when I was pretty young. I was actually twelve years old. I've always loved to read. When I read a book called The Late Great Planet Or and it just s Donne to me. And it wasn't long after that that, even though I'd long been a church attendee, you know, my whole life, I'd gone to church short as it was at that point in time, it just made me realize that that there's stuff coming that this world needs to know about. And you know, God has offered a plan of redemption to all humankind. So the Late Great Planet Earth was really instrumental in piquing my interest even as a young man. Well, it's interesting how God unveils these things that we need to know for the right time and season early on. I think our life would parallel a bit here, Barry that I wasn't much interested in Bible prophecy, didn't hear much about it in the church, you know, occasionally ran into it. And it's interesting The Light Gray Planet Earth. How you know that book, you talk about a book coming into the culture with powerful annoys. Because so many people were so affected by this, it's as if God himself said, I'm going to give this to hal Lindsay's going to write this book, and this is going to open up

6:12 the gates and open up the minds of those who are called by my name. Well, you know, it's interesting the timing of that inspired book, and it's based on scriptures. So I think you are well along the right path by saying that God initiated the timing of this. And you know, certainly the content is based upon the things we're studying now and watching come to pass. But at that point in time, there was a massive sense of the absence of purpose and all, you know, in the hippie movement and all that stuff. So you know, you see the same thing happening today. Here we are now watching the world that's completely lost its way, and yet we're living in what hell Lindsey wrote about some years ago. So it's just God wants us to know what's coming. And you know, Bill, I think it's so important that we highlight the fact that Bible prophecy is what distinguishes the Bible from every other spiritual or religious writing. God speaks about the future with authority that others can speak about the president of the past, and everything he says is coming to pass just as he said it would. No other God compares to our God, right, Barry, I mean another God has the courage to be able to call the you know, the end from the beginning of the beginning, from the end. He knows it all, and he lays it out. And as you say, with Bible prophecy,

7:45 it's been estimated that roughly two thirds of that which he had prophesied has come to come to realization one thousand percent. I often tell people, what do you think the likelihood that the remaining third is also going to be filled? A bill in a thousand percent? I think I'll put my money on God. Okay, my money, in my faith, my my eternity. Let's let's put it that way, because that's what it comes down to. And you're exactly right, that's exactly what distinguishes his word and distinguish uh, he Almighty God from all others who claim to be God. Uh. You know, they they can't even come close uh to uh, you know, to God Almighty, Who's who's credited all you You know, you think about this, Barry, and you know, you look over his creation, you look at humanity the way he designed is. I mean, we're all walking miracles.

8:39 I wake up every morning as I mentioned you, I live here in Florida. I'm on the east coast, and I wake up, I overlook a you know, a lake. I'm seeing you know, life abounding in uh in the in the ducks that float on the lake, and uh you know, other foliage and and uh and wildlife and and a and I got a bunch of crazy uh uh you know, crazy geckos and you know that are It's unbelievable. You know, the Bible talks about lizards that they're so common that they even live in you know, in kings homes. And that's right, right, So I mean here and I'll tell you I think these and there's something about it. I was telling my wife, I think these uh, these animals here, I think they're part uh you know, they're part termites because it sounds like they're eating through you know, the fourth it's crazy, you know. But but regardless all that being said, the magnificence of God's creation, I don't know how you how you cannot see it.

9:41 I mean you almost have to be so stubborn to say I'm going to refuse to see the glory of God. Yeah, you won't see what you don't want to I think that's really the bottom line and the things we're watching and hearing about today. And I too, you know, look at the majesty of creation, goodness gott in a desert and look at the night sky, and to know that God names and numbers the stars, and that's that's quite a significant being who has such capacities. And you know, Bill, one of the things I think that's interesting in just in light of you know, so many people who are critical of the Bible savers written by Man. I've met a lot of people over the years, and I've never met anybody smart enough to write this book, and you know, just to talk about the future with such authority. But if you just think about Jesus, the prophecies about the coming, the first coming of the Messiah, you know, it wasn't that, you know, the Bible didn't say, you know, some guy's going to come along and and he's you know, he's going to be from this particular area. You know, the Bible gave specifics and it was only possible for the divine guidance to speak with these things or speak of these things with such authority. I mean, think about the birth of the Messiah.

11:00 He had to be born of a virgin. There's one criteria. He had to be born in Bethlehem, and he was born in Bethlehem, but interestingly he was known by the name of another city. He'll be called a Nazarene. So here you've got one born of a virgin, born in Bethlehem, but known as the Nazarene. And then you throw on top of that that he was called out of Egypt. So you know, just the possibilities. It's not just some guesses or no stradamus like predictions where exactly it could be this or it could be that. No, they are specific in there on target, and everything prophesied about jesus first coming happened as written, so we can rest as short as you said earlier, one hundred or one thousand percent everything written about a second coming is going to come to pass as well.

11:48 Yeah, without a doubt. We're talking Barry Stagner, the recognized authority on biable prophecies, new book The Time of the Signs. Verry, can you imagine what it must have been like for Paul, right, you know, he has the confrontation, you know, with Jesus on the road to Damascus, and he is motivated to look back on scripture and the very things that you just outlined right now. And then some he discovers Jesus in the Old Testament that he's been studying all his life, all these scrolls that he's opened up, you know, a week after week and he has read and he's been taught by you know, some of the top scholars and religious figures of the day, and he's going, oh, there's Jesus. There he is again there. Well, yeah, he did that. Could you imagine how the light and the revelation that went off in his mind as he starts, you know, connecting the dots and then he gets so excited that he out there and accepts God, God's mission for his life to go in and take the gospel message, you know, to the gentile nations. Yeah.

13:09 That makes a great point, Bill, because you know, one Corinthians two fourteen talks about the natural man cannot discern the things of God because they are spiritually discerned. And it's like Jesus conversation with Nicodemus who came to him at night, you know, saying, nobody can do the things you're doing unless God is with him, and Jesus immediately says, you're the teacher of Israel, and you don't know that you have to be born again. And that was really the missing link for Paul too. You know, he was reading through the eyes of a Pharisee and years of Judaism and all of the forced interpretations of things that they were looking for. They were looking for Messiah who would come in the manner that Jesus comes again. They were looking for the guy on the war horse exactly, you know. And so when Jesus came to fix their biggest problem, which was their sin nature, they wanted nothing to do with that, thinking well, hey, we're Jews, we don't need that. So Paul, you know, himself, experienced the blindness in part that he would later write about and you must be born again. That's that's the story of the Bible. Well, and the thing also at that point in time, and I've I've talked about this quite often, Barry, is that missing your appointed time? I mean, here Jesus is coming into Jerusalem. He looks over Jerusalem and he weeps, and and what I sense when I read that is his heart's breaking because the people that he came to deliver are missing their appointed time, and they're a pointed time. You know,

14:45 each of our appointed time with God isn't necessarily you know, forever. Sometimes some moments are more significant in others in God's economy, aren't they? Oh? Absolutely, And recognizing the days that we now live in through the lens of Bible prophecy should create in all of us an urgency for those around us who aren't willing to see and or are unable to see because they've yet to receive Christ and have their eyes open to be able to discern the scripture. But you know, Bill, one of the things I think that's important as we recognize we don't know the day or the hour, and it's silly to make predictions or set dates, and we don't do that. But you know, we do know that Jesus when he said no man knows the day or the hour, he followed that with But as it was in the days of Noah social Habe, when the Son of Man comes again and he gives some description of how life was on earth as Lucra cords buying and selling, marrying and giving a marriage until the day that they Know and Company entered the arc. And you know, we're living in the days that were as they were in Noah's So we're living around people who are going to go into the tribulation, So we need to tell them what's coming. We need to let them know that there's going to guy be a guy that rises up from the geographic region of the Pax Romana, the Roman Empire, and he's going to lead the world into a unity that it's not experienced, solve the Middle East

16:18 crisis, allow the Jews to build their temple. He's going to require some type of market identification on your hand or your forehead that allows you to connect commerce and all these things that the Bible says they're going to happen. And people now who won't receive the good news of the Gospel when they see those things begin to be fulfilled, and they'll check the rest of it out. I believe right. Well, that's the big exchange, isn't it? The legitimate for the illegitimate? Here we are. You know, you've got a rebuilding of a temple that really is redundant and unnecessary if you think about it, Barry, because you know, if you've been born again, you are a temple of the Living God, right, So why would you need a new temple. Yeah, exactly right. But if you're not discerning, as you said earlier, and that is absolutely key, if you're not discerning and mature enough. Is the Book of Hebrews talks about. Is that if you are not mature in the faith to see these things and you're still living as a child, even though you say you're a Christian, you're going to miss out because you're not going to be able to discern good from evil. And I think this is where we are right now, is that so much of the planet, it's not just America, and it's not just but it's just so much of God's creation right now is holding on to two values in such a way that they're being blinded and they can't discern good from evil. They refuse to accept that. For example, you know you mentioned Israel, what happened with Israel in Amas. I don't know anybody who is a born again

17:53 Christian that does not acknowledge that what happened in Israel, you know, by Almas, was an act of evil. Yeah, and yet the world is waving Palestinian flags, which is rather bizarre in and of itself, since there's no country named Palestine. It's the land of Israel. And you know, watching all these things in the just the blatant ignorance, and it's a willful ignorance that we're seeing happening today. People don't want to know. I mean, look at the United Nothing, you know, the UN and all of its positions and resolutions against Israel. Yet they say nothing about China, they say nothing about you know, the punishments in Saudi Arabia, they say nothing about Iran and or Cuba. And yet everything it seems that they target is in relation to the nation of Israel, the chosen people of God back in their national homeland. So yes, that we live in an upside down and backwards world and Israel is the centerpiece. There's just no question about that.

18:59 And that's that's exactly what Zechari twelve three said would come to pass well. And you refer to, you know, Israel being God's time piece. I've often said Berry, and maybe the last time we talked about i'd share this with you that I believe that in nineteen forty eight, when Israel became a nation again, it was as if the hour hand of God's prophetic clock was set. And what we've been experiencing since then are minutes and seconds, and I would dare say that the second hand is spinning right now. It just seems to be moving with such rapidity, you know, to the degree. And I've referred to this as well that when Billy Graham before he passed, was asked by a reporter says, well, doctor Graham, are these the last days? And Eiden has day, he said, these are the last of the last days. Amen. And I agree with that assessment completely, watching the speed in which things are happening, because that's a component of the last day scenario as well. And then you know, Jesus in at Matthew twenty four three to eight, what I call the preamble to the all of a discourse, he used the phrase that can be translated as he said beginning of sorrows in our translations, But that phrase means the commencement of birth pangs, and birth pangs follow a specific progression. And you know, when the natural course of things is left alone, you will find that the intensity and frequency of the birth pangs are going to get closer and closer together. And

20:30 that's exactly what we've been watching. And I agree one hundred percent that that when the nation was founded again and God brought them back, the Jews, back into the national homeland from the lands where he scattered them. He said, I'm doing this for my Holy Name's sake, And he spoke through the prophet Amos in chapter nine and said, once I bring him back, they're not going to be uprooted again. So that tells us in and of itself that they're back and things are wrapping up quickly, right exactly. Well, it's like, you know, for for quite a while here, Barry, pundits have referred to you know, I say, you know, the United States, but I say, it's the world. We've been at this tipping point. Well, what happens is I see this beyond the tipping point.

21:17 We're on the downward side of the mountain, and as we're going down, we're picking up speed. So that's what it looks like to me, is that we're beyond that tipping point. That's why things are happening with such rapidity. I mean, Barry, look look at what's happened in the culture just in the last couple of years. I mean, can you imagine you know, having you know, sex changes, and we're all pronouns sensitive. Now people are losing their jobs there. You know, their way of life is being threatened because they've used the wrong pronouns. And I mean, this is absolutely insane where we are. And you know, it's no wonder. You know, people are getting so depressed. Suicide rate is on an increase by every measure, whether it's young people, older people, it's just it's just absolute chaos. And it's like not only we back to the times and the days of no it's almost like we're back to the opening chapter of Genesis where the land was dark and void. You know, in watching all the stuff that we've been seeing happen, it's almost a digression that does go exactly to where you said, all the way back up to Genesis. And we see this digression presented to us in Roman chapter one, you know, where the creation by a divine being is denied, and you know this preference that we see today of the evolutionary process or the march for molecules demand is what is preferred and the consequences that are recorded there in Roman chapter one. Twice God

22:51 gives them up to their decisions, and then he finally gives them over to it and that's the point, the proverbial point of no return, and I believe that we are there. We've reached a place where there's no going back. And you know, God of course is still unwilling that any should perish. But you have to want to not perish and make the decisions to follow after what God has provided in order to not perish. But the world wants nothing to do with it today. Each person wants to do what's in their own mind and the thoughts and intents of their hearts. It is only evil continually. Well, you know, going back to what you said earlier, it is knowledge is abounding, and God's clear and stating that it is people without knowledge, without revelation, they are the ones that perish. This is what's hanging in the balance. It's, you know, back to that crossroads of life or death. That's what stands before you. And I love that the Holy Spirit quickly, you know, doesn't even wait for you to answer.

23:56 It's almost like no sooner does he posed the questioning. I's the answer right away. Choose life. Don't even think about dude. Life, that's right, that's right, And look at what's happening in our world today. Death is the choice on so many levels. And that's not just a saying or colloquialism that that's a fact people choose death, the death of the unborn. And I was reading some articles over the past couple of days about, you know, this euthanasia thing that's going on. Oh yeah, absolutely. You know, now you can make the decision for a mentally ill person in some places and just simply end their life, or make the decision yourself if you don't want to go through the late stages of cancer and all those kind of things. So you know, death is on the ballot of personal choicing days, and it's just such a strange thing to see happen. Well, and it's getting to the point barrier. It's not going to be your choice.

24:52 It's the government making the choice because they figure, okay, we can't afford to carry you any longer. You know, we're paying for migrants, we're illegal migrants, were you know, paying for all these entitlements. You know, we've had to after all, you know, we had to get elected and so we bought all these votes and so you know, you're thirty three trillion dollars in debt and we just can't afford you. You know, if you're not a productive part and a cog in this republic machine, then you're unnecessary and we'll do like they do in China. We'll just you know, we'll just use your body parts and make sure that you're good to the very last drop. I guess. Yeah, it's interesting you brought up China because there's been some reports of late that there, you know, one child per family is going to have cataclysmic results by twenty fifty and they will not have a working age population, and they're they're in deep trouble and they it's irreversible. And there's other countries around the world that are in that same place.

25:52 But you know, watching all these things happen again just gives the credibility of the Bible such a great stronghold and any person that really wants to know the truth, because it's reliable, you can trust in it. And all that it says is going to will come to pass is going to come to pass. Exactly is written. And boy, we have more evidence now than any generation before us. And yet what's happening. You know, the false religions are growing by leafs and bounds, and the Church is divided and you've got all these nonsensical things that are pursued, like Paul said, and second Tivity chapter four, fabrications that tickle the year. I'veferred over actual biblical truth and apostolic doctrines. And it's just I'd say, today be a good day for the Lord to come get us. Amen, looking up and thinking, Okay, well, am I hearing any trumpet blastes of time for the rep thing between me and you Berry. I'll see you up there hopefully. You know, we'll have a fun time on our way up. But you know, you mentioned China and the one thing, the other thing that's overlooked you're saying twenty fifty. And I think the trouble they have right now, which nobody's reporting on, is the fact that you have a lot of men.

27:14 I mean, the male to female ratio is extraordinary, and you have a lot of men who, in the natural course of their humanity, want to pro create. Well, they want to have a wife. Well, guess what, there's no wives. There's not enough. There's not enough women, unless all of a sudden there's some sort of acceptance, you know, to you know, for a woman to have multiple husbands or or somehow you know, President g comes up with, you know, some sort of story like for the Muslims that hey, guys, if you die, you got seventy two virgins, you know, waiting for you. On the other side, you know, you know, I see a lot of you know, future, if not current frustration that is not going to be contained there in China.

28:00 No, And there was a woman who was being interviewed who had actually escaped the sex trafficking trade there in China, and she was talking about the fact that because of what you mentioned and the ratio of men versus women, that there are villages and towns that where a woman is basically trafficked within that village so that men can fulfill their sexual desires and there's no escaping in And it just reminded me, you know what one of the products of the Babylonian system that has talked about in Revelation seventeen eighteen is the bodies and souls of men, and this is exactly what we're seeing happen today out of that.

28:41 You know, that naturally God given drive, sex drive that he places in people, and you know, the men because of what the decisions from this regime and how it has impacted and created this imbalance. You know, they were boarding if they could determined that the child was a girl, because the name is so important in China and it's carried on through the man. They were just abort the child. And now here they are and they've created you know this open the proverbial Pandora's box where one thing has now caused something else to happen, including the sex trafficking of of these poor women. Well, this is what happens when you interfere with the natural balance that God had credit right. And this is what you're interfering with. And there are consequences here.

29:30 And you look and you see this as another dangerous sign on the horizon that you you're going to have a lot of angry young men because because they're not you know, fulfilling you know, their natural their natural desires. And so get ready back to your book for just a moment here, Uh, I noticed that you you have the forward by a mere Safari. How did you? How did you meet him? Here? Actually it was some years ago that I was asked by a personal friend, another pastor that I'd known for years. Uh. He had taken over a church in Cincinnati where the pastor had passed away, and then they asked him to come and step in.

30:18 And we were from the same church in southern California, so we knew each other very well. He said, hey, would you come back and do a prophecy conference. I said, sure, I'd love to. And I was under the impression that I was the only speaker. Yes, and which is quite an daunting task to fill the day by yourself. But two weeks before he says, hey, oh, by the way, the other speaker is the mer Sarfai. And so we met there. And it was when I was teaching my excuse me, My wife was sitting right behind him, and I was teaching the Elemant on the Elemant discourse. And I believe that, you know, while the majority of it is related to the nation of Israel, I believe there are things that apply to the church age, simply because of the mention of the time before the flood. Right in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage. And if you look at Revelations seventeen and eighteen, the voice of the bride and bride Grimm has not heard there anymore. And the merchants of the earth are morning because there's no commerce, there's no buying and selling.

31:22 So it has to be in relation to the age, the end of the Church age, and that's exactly what we're seeing happen right now. Well, afterwards, he told me, he said, I've never heard another Calvary Chapel pastor teach that they all teach, or many teach that it's just exclusively about Israel. And you know, just kind of not just an interpretation that we shared, but I just feel like the Lord just knit our hearts together back then, and we have the same sense of humor. Neither one of us involved sensationalism in our teaching or writing, and so we're both very strongly against that. We think the Bible sensational enough on its own. But it was from that conference in Cincinnati. It wasn't long after that that we were talking, started doing stuff together online, and now we've pretty much been all over the world together teaching Bible prophecy. Well, you know, Barry, it's always fun when you're around someone that has, you know, the knowledge of Hebrew, who grew up with it or in the Greek language and the nuances of the culture. You know things that here on the West, you know, you read the Word of God and you only can get so much out of it. And then when you're around somebody who can bring in that layer of background, goof, it'll blow you away. I mean for me,

32:53 it's like Jonathan Cohn has become a dear friend of mine. I love being around him. In fact, when when I first met him, I said, Jonathan, I go, the things that you reveal to me as a Messianic rabbi, I go, you chicken skin me All the time, he didn't understand what I meant when I said that. I think it took it. I think it was like three years later he finally understood. You know, I said, you know, goose bumps and all he goes, oh, yeah, okay, yeah we had He goes, I thought it was a Mexican kind of thing. I guess, yeah, right, exactly know whatever, you know, Yeah, it was, but exactly to be around, you know, people that had the understanding of the culture, and all of a sudden, it's like, you know, the parts of the Bible.

33:40 It's kind of like, you know, when the first time I went to Israel, Barry, I just so much of the Bible, and people tell you all the time, there's nothing like go into Israel. Go to Israel, and you read the Bible differently, right, as a result of actually being there on you know, God's chosen land and then and around his people like that, It's just was real special. And you know, and especially when you're around people that have that background and understanding and you just go, oh, okay, yeah, that starts to make so much more sense, right, yeah. And I like the description of your first trip to Israel that it turns your Bible from black and white to color. Oh yeah, I think that's just absolutely a fitting description. And you know, for me the first few times I went to Israel, you know, somebody that's guiding the tour or whatever always says you're going to have a moment at some point in time, all this is going to hit you. You're going to see something that's a trigger and you're just going to be amazed at where you are and think about all that happened. And you know, most of the time, when you turn the corner in the bus and there you see the dome of the Rock Mosque and the Temple Mountain, all of that. For most people, that's the moment, because that's such a familiar scene. But for me driving down in the Galilee and seeing all the fields blooming and blossoming, and just the beauty of what was once nothing but a swamp, a desolate place where, you know, Mark Twain said, you know, even

35:15 though the desert, the cactus doesn't live there, you know, so, but to see it so lush and beautiful and that is just an undeniable fulfillment of God's word. Well, and how God has blessed the people to do that. You know, the the innovation of irrigation there that you know came uh you know, from the Israelis, the Jews that were there, and they have been more than willing berry to share it with people. Oh and for people who have wanted to embrace it and enjoy the benefits. I mean, because you know, people don't realize, you know that it was it's just a flat out desert. Nothing grew out there, and then here they come and they start making things grow there. I mean, it was it was so desolate that even you know, the Arabs after nineteen forty eight when they told they were told they want, you know, they could be out there and live in the fact, no, we want nothing to do with it, right, Yeah, And you know talking about their innovation, and you know, so much of that I think God inspires and points them in the right direction. And you know what wasn't desert was marsh and you know, both were unfriendly to growing crops. And just to think about the very practical wisdom, they heard that eucalyptus trees are very thirsty. So they imported eucalyptus trees, planted them in the swamps, and they sucked up all the excess water and turned the soil back into rich you know, farmland, and

36:47 it's just amazing and really to see the land today, Yeah, I got to tell you my moment happened. I was at the Western Wall, right, and we're there for Shabbat, I mean, was the start of the Sabbath. And to watch the Jews coming into the area there in the Western Wall, hand in hand, arm in arm, celebrating, praising God, rejoicing, thanking God, you know, for the Sabbath day. Oh my gosh, Barry, that was just I still see it to this day, and every time I do, it enriches me. You know. It's one place and you know, having traveled, you know, not just with the mirror and for you know, conferences, but just as family, you know, doing a fair amount of traveling. You know, you always usually at the end of the trip, you're ready to go home and got things on the to do list and all that stuff. At least I am. But I think Israel is the only place where on the flight home, I'm thinking, when can I go back? Exactly? Something so unique about it, exactly because you know that you know, I was there for a week and there was still so much more and we were you know, almost every second of our time was being orchestrated, and it was it was a whirlwind.

38:06 Uh and it was just like, wow, you know, can we just slow things down for a little bit, because I think one day they gave us maybe two hours to go and you know, go do some you know shopping and you know, souvenir shopping and that sort of thing. I got to tell you, I was so exhausted, I just take no teligentle map. I'm going to give a pass on that. So but yeah, I'm like you, I can't wait to get back there. You know, in your book, you know, when we'd mentioned this several times and that is the imminent return of Jesus Christ. He said he will come again to judge the living and the dead. We know that there's going to be the rapture before then, but then there's going to be that ultimate, the the ultimate time that he returns. And then we head into the final chapter of the Book of Revelations with that in mind. What would you say, you know, to our viewers who still remain skeptical of Jesus's return, Well, you know, there are certain prophetic elements that if he doesn't return, are not going to be fulfilled, and that disqualifies the Bible from being one hundred percent accurate. So it has to happen. He promised his disciples at the Last Supper, and you know they were very discouraged. And he opened John fourteen with let not your heart be troubled. And you know that word translated is let could also be translated as stop stop letting your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in me. And then he describes the Mini

39:39 Mansions and he says, I'm going to prepare place for you. And if I go to prepare place for you, I will come again and receive you. Under myself to where I am you may be also, well, if there's no rapture, what exactly does that mean? And how are we going to be received under himself as it? You know, it can't be that we all have to die, because then that would discredit First Gridians fifteen exactly what Paul said. We will not all die, but we shall all be changed. What do you do with first Thessalonians four? What do you do with second Thessalonians two? And these passages that are clear that the Second Testlonians too the hindering force of the Holy Spirit. As you mentioned earlier, we are the temples of the Holy Spirit, exactly we and the spirit in us is restraining the rise of the lawless one. We have to be taken out of the way. And then you know, the dead in Christ, they're going to rise first, and we who are alive and remain will meet them in the air. If there's no rapture, what does that mean? You know all of these things. It leaves a gaping hole in the scripture.

40:50 If there is no rapture, the Church, and certainly the second coming of Christ is you know, Revolation nineteen eleven to sixteen. It makes it very very clear that he is coming and we're coming with him. So how do we get there? You're right, you know, if we didn't get raptured or caught up in a moment and twinkling of an eye. So the Lord, you know, it's a it's a biblical necessity that he come and get us, that he and that we come back with him. So and the evidence is all over the place. And again, if you believe tewod Timoty three sixteen that all scripture is given by inspiration of God, then all scripture means exactly that, all scripture exacluding John fourteen one to three and all the rest. Well, it's as necessary as the empty tomb, isn't it?

41:39 Oh? Absolutely yeah? And you know you've got so many things that if you just think about the famous Christmas passage, you know, unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given, and his name shall be called Wonderful counselor Mighting God, everlasting Father, Prince of Peace and of his government. There shall be no end. What's he going to do that it didn't happen the first time he came. He didn't sit on David's throne. He didn't rule the world. He didn't rule as Palm too says, he didn't rule the nations with a rod of iron. And he came back, or he came the first time as the Lamb of God to take away the sins of the world. And you know, Bill, I think you know what you mentioned earlier about the Jews and how much wonderful information we gleaned from, especially Messianic Jews. If you think about it, there was fifteen hundred years of passover lambs, and what that was communicating to Israel was that innocent blood is required to cover sin. And now here John the Baptist sees Jesus and says, behold the Lamb of God, he who has come in essence to fulfill what the passover lamb was pointing to shed his innocent blood to take away the sins of the whole world. So, you know, it's just incredible the things we find if we sincerely investigate scripture exactly. And it had to be Jesus, Berry, it had to be the Son of God, the perfect sacrifice to serve as our propitiation, that perfect sacrifice that would

43:15 satisfy you know, God's demand for justice. Yes, well, you look at the you know, the beautiful love story of Ruth and Boaz and the Kinsman Redeemer and that practice in Israel. You know, there were four requirements for one to be a redeemer, a kinsman redeemer. One you had to be related, and the pre incarnate Christ was not related to us. A relation to him was sacrificed in the Garden of Eden when man fell into sin and consciously chose to disobey God. You know, he also had to be willing to redeem. Jesus said, nobody takes my life. I lay it down of my own accord. And lastly he had or thirdly, he had to be able to redeem. He had to be able to pay the redemption price, and the redemption price was innocent blood, and all the rest of us have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. And the fourth qualification, and the final qualification is he could not be indebted himself. Jesus did not owe the wages of sin exactly because he was sinless. So he met the beautiful qualifications of the kinsman redeemer. And that required, as you pointed out so wonderfully, his humanity. He had to come and it could only be Jesus God with us Amen, Amen, very God. About four and a half minutes left here in the book, you lay out a basic

44:52 chronology of the end times, which is important because you know, as we talked about the age of information, and now we've entered into that age of misinformation now more than ever. We are called to be like the Bareans or the brothers isa Gar, who were students of the times in the Bible that we read about, so that we would not be caught off guard, that we would be true discerners of the truth of God. This is why a biblical worldview is so critical, especially at this time and season. Well, you know, if you think about some of the things that are developing currently that we will see, and you know, the tribulation doesn't last long enough for some of the things to develop. There has to be a mentality that's taken into it that pre existed of the tribulation period to be willing to see those who are against the supposed greater good that the Antichrist has brought to be people who are worthy of death. So you have to have that kind of mentality going in to support it when it happens and we need to know that those types of things are precursors to what's going to be fulfilled then. But you know, the other thing I think that's interesting is we may see Isaiah seventeen to one fulfilled. We may see the destruction of Damascus that may be the catalyst. Well you look at it now almost it almost seems like we're almost maybe one bomb away from from it being decimated, right, Yeah.

46:27 Well, you know it's interesting if you look up a drone footage Damascus on YouTube, there's multiple videos that do a flyover and it is all but a ruin is heap. I mean, it's amazing to see. But you know, with watching these things come to pass and not losing hope or falling into fear is something that's exclusive to those who know what's coming exactly. Yeah, That's why I think it is so important that we know God wants us to know. He put it in his book, well, laying out just point by point, base is Berry. If you would, what are the next things to happen in God's timeline? Well, I believe, as we talked about it at the beginning of the show, the rebirth of the nation of Israel got the clock moving, and now we're seeing multiple things happen simultaneously.

47:19 One, we are in the throes of the great falling away the apostasia in the church. There's a replacement of truth with fables. We're watching that happen as we are watching the Zachari twelve for twelve to three prophecy moving in a fulfillment direction, as the world is turning against the nation of Israel. I believe that what we could see next is the Isaiah seventeen to one, fulfillment of the destruction of Damascus and the launch of the Ezekie War. That's possible, but I do not believe that we will see the end of the Ezekiel War, because it is a supernatural wrath of God that brings it to an end, and we have no appointment with that. We'll be off the planet before that happens. So it could be that, you know, we're watching all these things developed that will reach their ultimate fulfillment during the tribulation. We could see the Isaiah seventeen to one. We could see the start of the Ezekiel War. But I believe before the Ezekiel War ends, we would see the rapture of the Church because it's God's direct wrath that brings it to an end, and so we'll be gone. And then you know that way.

48:30 One thing I think people off and overlook is that in the Ezekiel War, God is going to destroy those invading armies and leave them dead on the mountains of Israel. And that accounts for the vast majority, some ninety five percent of radical Islam, right, So God's going to destroy radical Islam. And then you know, having watched that happen, having seen the God of the Bible defend the nation of Israel, who's going to say the Jews can't build a temple right, and we won't be here for that either, And the Antichrist will come forward with the plant. So you know, once that happens in the rest, we'll just fall right into places chronologically described in the Bible.

49:12 Well, ladies and gentlemen's right there in his book The Time of the Signs very Stagner's new book. We need to be people of knowledge, of spiritual knowledge, spiritual issues that are happening right before your very eyes. It is what's causing you to look out because your redemption draws nigh. Very again, thank you so much for being with us. Your book available in all the usual places right, yes, it is. It's on pretty sale right now. It comes out January sixteenth. And if the audience would find it in their hearts to pre purchase it right now, that would be so helpful because that increases the possibility of it winding up on a shelf at it Sarget or Walmart or one of the other brick and mortar stores. Well, definitely this this is a book for our time that you need to read and be, you know, have it be part of your reserve of knowledge and the truth from a biblical worldview the time of the signs. Very Stagners bear a guest Barry. I cannot thank you enough God blessed, thank you so much for being thanks for having me. You got it. Our thanks to Barry Stagner, who's a pastor in Orange County, California, in Tustin. He's a recognized authority on Bible prophecy. And again, the book will be available on the nineteenth. You can buy it for pre purchase. I highly recommend that you do so. Again. Our thanks to you as well for being with us and sharing a part of your day and to hear more about this

50:44 most important subject, the time of the signs. May God bless you and keep you. May make his face shine upon you, may be gracious unto you and give you His peace. Thanks again for being with us. God blessed was, predicts the pub